| Name: |
NautiqueFrk
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/15/2012 6:37:00 PM
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The Sunset Point and Stone View Summit area was turned down a few weeks ago for no wake signs due to not having a boat ramp or marina in the area, so I was told by someone, who also lives in the area. But if you go to the area northwest about 3 soughs over to the right, when coming out of the Stone Veiw Summit area, in Stillwaters, there are 3 no wake signs going into the mouth of one and down the lake in the Over Look area there are 2 going into the mouth of another with none of the above items anywhere in site. These are just a few, I have seen several, other places all over the lake that do not meet the requirement. Just curious to know how all these got placed.
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| Name: |
Spot Remover
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/16/2012 12:38:59 PM
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There are No Wake buoys around restaurants also. Had not heard that the area was turned down. Sure would like to see the official letter denying the request. Anybody seen one?
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| Name: |
NautiqueFrk
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/16/2012 3:30:54 PM
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I was there the day around the 2 of July, the Marine Police came up to the pier at Sunset Point and talked with the lady, that filed a complaint with Alabama Power and contacted a LT. with the Marine Police, in Montgomery. The LT is the one who sent the patrol boat to the location, to survey the area. The home owner was told by the officer in the boat that the permit was denied for the above reasons. This was not the first time they have been there, they came last year as well. They know there is a problem, I guess someones got to be killed or hurt before something is done. I just want to how all the other places mentioned above are able to have them placed.
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| Name: |
Spot Remover
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/16/2012 4:34:05 PM
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I guess all of the other people that have asked for help, just stay in the dark on this stuff. (That is if they weren't standing on the dock with the lady when the MP came by). Believe me, there have been many attempts to get the state off their behinds, but they are not willing to co-operate.
I guess we start with Bentley next time and see what we can do to get him out of office.
Russell doesn't have any problems with this. If Alfa was involved, they would get what they want.
Concerned citizens get the hind ----. Heck, I just about bet if they asked, the locals would put enough in the kitty to pay for the No Wake signs and hire another marine patrol.
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| Name: |
Kizma Anuice
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| Subject: |
WHOLE LAKE "NO WAKE" ZONE
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Date:
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7/16/2012 6:16:14 PM
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If every person that wanted a no wake zone got it the whole lake would be "NO WAKE"
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| Name: |
Capt M Brooks
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/16/2012 6:25:24 PM (updated 7/16/2012 6:36:07 PM)
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Some of the buoys you are referring to were probably placed illegally. We recently removed 3 from the lake and have identified several others that will be taken out as soon as we have the time to remove them. You can look for us to review every single restrictive buoy (not including hazard buoys) in the coming months and revamp our entire process for Lake Martin. By the time we are finished I anticipate that several existing buoys will be removed due to outdated or no longer valid permits.
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| Name: |
Capt M Brooks
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/16/2012 6:34:50 PM
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Captain Shipman forwarded the permit application to me. Officer Cartwright and I were the officers who spoke to the lady you mention but we did so in the course of our normal patrol activity. We were not there assessing the area, as I am already thoroughly familiar with it. That particular area is patrolled twice per shift by our officers and has been for some time. I personally have patrolled it dozens of times in the past 2-3 years. The main complaint we have received regarding that area has been regarding damage to docks and docked boats from other boat wake. A no wake zone in that slough is still not going to prevent wake coming from the main body of Moon Brook or even Blue Creek from impacting those docks. If I approve a permit for an area that does not meet our criteria, then I have to approve all permit applications that cross my desk out of fairness.
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| Name: |
NautiqueFrk
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/16/2012 6:54:47 PM
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Is there anyway you can post, or tell us where to go find where a person can go read, just what the criteria is? I think there might be several people interested in reading it for themself.
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| Name: |
au67
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/16/2012 7:00:09 PM
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Does LMRA install "No Wake" buoys?
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| Name: |
Kizma Anuice
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| Subject: |
half mile no wake zone going to Catherine's dock
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Date:
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7/16/2012 7:13:48 PM
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The Spring HOuse dock area may or may not meet the criteria, but the extent of the no wake zone is ridiculous.
Also there is a no wake zone at the Wind Creek fishing dock next to Creme at the Creek. I was there at the dock and a dude on a seadoo came in to get a burger. A square badge Barney started yelling at the dude, NO WAKE. The dude stood up on the seat of his seadoo and held his arms in the air to show he was not applying any gas. Quite honestly if he had been able to go slower, which he could not, he would not have been able to stear.
The square badge kept yelling so the dude on the sea doo hauled azz.
Can anything be done about either of these situations?
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| Name: |
NautiqueFrk
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| Subject: |
half mile no wake zone going to Catherine's dock
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Date:
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7/16/2012 7:52:24 PM
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I know the area too. The only thing I can say is RUSSELL, they pretty much get what they what. Just ask them
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| Name: |
Spot Remover
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/16/2012 8:10:23 PM
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Not saying you guys aren't patrolling the area, but I haven't seen a patrol boat in the area this year. Are you using other types of vessels?
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| Name: |
wix
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| Subject: |
Heard Al Power bought
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Date:
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7/16/2012 8:32:53 PM
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A pile of No Wake buoys for the first Aquapalooza. Guess RL got to use them all afterwards for Springhouse and Sinclairs. Is there a connection??
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| Name: |
NautiqueFrk
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/16/2012 8:53:54 PM
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Well, maybe when we all can go, and read the rules of the road, our minds wills be at rest. Hopefully someone will shed some light on where we can go find the criteria written down, so all can enjoy. Just my two cents worth.
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| Name: |
Kizma Anuice
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| Subject: |
half mile no wake zone going to Catherine's dock
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Date:
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7/16/2012 9:03:23 PM
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I am pretty sure these buoys were there before Russell Cross Roads. The Russell people I have spoken with wish they were not there. Say it impedes business.
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| Name: |
CAT BOAT
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/16/2012 9:44:20 PM
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Well said Capt. Brooks. The entire lake can't be a "no wake zone". Lets spend this time on education.
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| Name: |
Capt M Brooks
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| Subject: |
My Post From 6/25/2009
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Date:
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7/16/2012 9:44:55 PM
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Here is the information you are looking for, from my post to this forum on 6/25/2009:
The Alabama Marine Police is the permitting agency in regard to the restriction of any portion of a public body of water to Idle Speed Only/No Wake. It is our responsibility to mark such zones and maintain the buoys around State-owned public launching areas and facilities. If an individual or a group of individuals wishes to make an application for the restriction of a portion of a public body of water to Idle Speed Only/No Wake then they need to contact our office at (256) 329-2268. We will discuss the application process and forward an application to that person. Once we receive the completed application, our officers will inspect the location to see if it meets any of the criteria set by our policy for approval. If approval is granted for the restriction, then the permit-holder is responsible for purchasing, placing and maintaining the buoy(s). In order to meet the criteria, the area in question must contain a public launching facility where any member of the public may launch a boat free of charge (AND/OR) must contain a gasoline dispensing facility (AND/OR) must present a paramount risk to public safety as determined by the reviewing officer(s). That being said, it is the duty of the Marine Police Division to safeguard public waters for the use of the entire general public. The overwhelming majority of applications are denied due to the fact that the area in question does not meet our criteria for approval. Under the public safety consideration, we use the number of complaints regarding the area, the number of accidents or incidents that have been reported there and our own observations of traffic flow to make our decision. People should also keep in mind that there are currently a number of Idle Speed Only/No Wake Buoys on the lake that were placed by private citizens that have not been permitted. When we identify such a buoy we remove it from the lake once we have the time to do so. The Marine Police Division does not permit Hazard Buoys but all Hazard Buoys must be approved for placement by us. We also place and maintain some buoys. We work very closely with the Lake Martin Resource Association on the placement of other Hazard Buoys. The LMRA bears the costs for the placement and maintenance of such buoys and provides us with the GPS coordinates of every such buoy on the lake. These folks really are to be thanked for their hard work at keeping boaters on Lake Martin safe. A number of people place "swim buoys" or mooring buoys off the ends of their docks. We don't have a problem with this as long as these buoys don't interfere with the normal flow of traffic for the slough and are not placed more than 25-feet from the end of the dock.
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| Name: |
Capt M Brooks
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/16/2012 9:48:54 PM
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LMRA offers a service to their members who already hold an established permit to replace buoys as they wear out or are damaged. LMRA DOES NOT permit or have a say in the permitting of Idle Speed Zones or No Wake Areas.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/16/2012 10:07:45 PM
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Capt. Brooks, perhaps you can address the issue of proper dock construction and boat mooring. It seems to me that many of these complaints (not all) are by people that do not want to spend the money to properly design their docks and boathouses to account for the inevitable waves that happen on a lake. No doubt there are more than enough inconsiderate boaters out there but if you design and build properly it is more an annoyance than anything else.
We had a guy near the front of our slough who would literally pop a nut if you came through at 1200 rpm. He complained to your officers and they came by our dock and mostly commiserated with how ridiculous he was about this issue (even though it was one of our neighbors that cruised in a little faster). No doubt you guys have a tough job dealing with people who buy lake houses and then complain about all those boats that actually make waves. As I tell them, if you want to avoid waves buy a farm.
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| Name: |
NautiqueFrk
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| Subject: |
My Post From 6/25/2009
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Date:
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7/17/2012 5:08:13 AM (updated 7/17/2012 6:23:24 AM)
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There are more boats in that area floating, than there are at most of the marina's on the lake and in less area. As far as a gas pump, hang around for more than 10 minutes, check out how much gas is being brought in. One can have a harbor or marina without a boat ramp or defined gas pump. You still have not answered my question, where can a person go read this information for himself instead of on this forum.
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| Name: |
Kizma Anuice
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| Subject: |
why are boats floating
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Date:
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7/17/2012 7:31:00 AM
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seems like the boat owners could put in lifts and thereby cure the problem.
why should the rest of the world have to slow down so that these boats can float
At the end of the day there would likely be as big or bigger a problem with the no wake zone. Boats slowing and accelerating would create wakes as would boats just driveing by the no wake zone.
JUST BUILD A LIFT AND SOLVE THE PROBLEM
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| Name: |
Spot Remover
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/17/2012 7:34:43 AM
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Too bad, Martini Man, that you are not familiar with the area of discussion. Come and look at the slips and tell me what construction, add-on, etc. can be done to help.
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| Name: |
Spot Remover
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| Subject: |
My Post From 6/25/2009
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Date:
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7/17/2012 7:41:00 AM
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I don't know of another similar situation on the lake. I also find it hard to "have to give" these buoys to other locations. Once again, there are none that I know of. Capt. Brooks, can you name one similar area?
I realize you guys have a very tough job, but sometimes common sense has to take precedence. And it isn't at this point.
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| Name: |
Spot Remover
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/17/2012 7:50:54 AM
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I don't think anyone is referring to a No Wake covering the whole lake. (Cat I know you are being facetious) But, somebody needs to spend some time watching this slough, and then tell us all that this area is not a major calamity waiting to happen.
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| Name: |
DSCR
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/17/2012 7:55:51 AM
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This type discussion reminds me of all the folks that buy homes near small airports, then complain that planes take off and land. The acronym NIMBY comes to mind. Buyer beware.
That being said, I too get tired of idiot drivers, on the road and on the lake. No clue of navigation rules, running with docking lights on, etc. But, as usual, additional laws and rules wont make idiots smarter, just inhibit what should be proper behavior.
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| Name: |
Spot Remover
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/17/2012 8:04:07 AM
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Some people bought prior to the "airport" being built. When the airplanes start doing the dangerous things that these idiots are doing, you "may" have a point. At least, with the buoys, there would be a definitive violation and not a judgement call by the officer. This is something that won't get pushed under the rug.
BTW, I have talked with 3 regular and part-time residents this morning, and they tell me that they have not seen an MP boat in the slough.
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| Name: |
NautiqueFrk
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| Subject: |
My Post From 6/25/2009
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Date:
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7/17/2012 8:31:02 AM
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The only way the Marine Police could have any idea on what goes on is to survey the area from the packing lot of the Stoneveiw Summit by car or truck on any major holiday or weeken. Not in a boat floating around in the water anywhere in the area.
Think about it.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/17/2012 8:46:19 AM
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I seriously doubt there is something special or unique about docks and slips in one area of Lake Martin versus another and I have been on the lake for over 12 years and have seen most of it. The lake is the lake, boats are boats, docks are docks, sloughs are sloughs and waves are waves. Its all the same and its the same issue year after year. If folks would spend the money to make them wave resistant they could stop worrying and complaining. All it does is make them unhappy. I decided to not have that area of frustration in my life and I am better off for it.
Alternatively they can complain, ask for no wake signs and then complain when they don't get them. They could also be a raving maniac like my neighbor and die of a massive coronary. That is not the point of my lake house and I know I can't change the heart of every boater to make them responsible and caring so I just deal with it and take responsibility for the protection of my own area. Life is too short to expect others to change to fit whatever we think it should be........
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| Name: |
wix
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| Subject: |
CPT Brooks
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Date:
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7/17/2012 8:50:38 AM
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Does Sinclairs and Spring House area meet your criteria. I don't think so.
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| Name: |
NautiqueFrk
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| Subject: |
CPT Brooks
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Date:
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7/17/2012 9:00:40 AM
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Hopefully you get an answer
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| Name: |
Spot Remover
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/17/2012 9:03:07 AM
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Hey, bud. I'm with you on most of that. I would like to know how to make our slips wave proof. Lifts are not plausible. My main area of concern, however, is that I'm going to witness someone getting seriously hurt. I've seen too many close calls. And most of it involves kids. Enough said.-- I'll continue to contact Brooks, Thompson, and Guy. At least I'll know that "I" have done all "I" can do. The rest is on their shoulders.
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| Name: |
Kizma Anuice
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| Subject: |
kids are main concern
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Date:
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7/17/2012 9:56:49 AM
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What is happening regarding kids that is your main concern. Are they swimming where they ought not to be swimming due to boat traffic?
Also you state that lifts are "not plausible", the question is not whether they are "plausible" it is whether or not they are "POSSIBLE" plausible is to subjective. It could be "not plausible" because ropes are cheaper.
No one cares about your opinion. Make it facts or forget it. And quit speaking in meaningless generalities.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/17/2012 10:12:46 AM
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I wasn't addressing people who pull floats and skiers too close to docks. No amount of laws will fix that problem and I am 100% in agreement that this is an area of necessary enforcement. We have people that pull them up our slough but they generally keep to the middle. We also have a couple of floats off the end of our dock and I have never seen anyone come inside them on either a boat or a jet ski. Leaves plenty of room for kids to float and swim and also doesn't block the slough.
I had thought the focus was on waves and damage to docks, etc.. We have tie downs and bumpers that prevent our boats from getting damaged by waves. They just roll around in the slip going up and down and back and forth. And our floating dock was overdesigned by a Ga Tech engineer and if you hit it you are going to sink. Yes it bangs around a bit with the waves but the metal posts are large and were pounded in to depth and cemented and are going nowhere. Same is true with our seawall, it was built to last and I simply don't have to worry about the waves.
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| Name: |
MrHodja
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| Subject: |
CPT Brooks
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Date:
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7/17/2012 10:25:26 AM
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I think the ones at Sinclairs are hazard buoys - there is an underwater ridge that angles out and to the left as you are looking at the water from the porch. No wake buoys in that loction would have as much effect as peeing on a forest fire.
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| Name: |
Wakesurfer
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| Subject: |
half mile no wake zone going to Catherine's dock
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Date:
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7/17/2012 10:58:22 AM
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Its pretty narrow back in that slough, those no wakes have been in place for as long as I've been on the lake.
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| Name: |
Wakesurfer
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| Subject: |
Marine Police can you give me some information
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Date:
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7/17/2012 11:00:28 AM (updated 7/17/2012 11:01:10 AM)
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100% Agreed with DCSR
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| Name: |
Kizma Anuice
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| Subject: |
half mile no wake zone going to Catherine's dock
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Date:
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7/17/2012 12:55:45 PM
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I thought I remembered them being there years ago. Didn't go there much because there was no reason, but now the are a problem getting to the Spring House. Women start complaining about the heat when you have to idle that far. And it is just a waste of time when there is nothing that meets the normal criteria for a no wake zone.
The Russell people say they wish it was that there so I am sure they would support the removal of the buoys.
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| Name: |
cstewa
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| Subject: |
half mile no wake zone going to Catherine's dock
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Date:
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7/17/2012 2:46:41 PM
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that slew is probably a little unique. It's narrow...but just wide enough and long enough that I bet back years ago people were trying to ski it. That probably led to the no wakes. I have some friends with cabins in that area. Kids are swimming everywhere. Occasionally people don't obey they no wake. Pretty scary when they don't.
In other words that is one place I probably agree with the No Wake bouy...and mind you it doesn't benefit me at all. I don't live there.
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