Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	Out Of Control
Date:	2/12/2019 8:02:37 PM

I was looking forward to a REDUCTION rather than an INCREASE….Why a budget with a deficit? Tax reduction was to increase revenue.

President Trump is proposing a $4 trillion-plus budget that projects a $1 trillion or so federal deficit. AP's Economic Reporter Josh Boak says the plan is like a 'Christmas list, a wish list' that amounts amounts to a 'massive bet'. (Feb. 12) AP

WASHINGTON – The national debt surpassed $22 trillion for the first time on Tuesday, a milestone that experts warned is further proof the country is on an unsustainable financial path that could jeopardize the economic security of every American. The Treasury Department reported the debt hit $22.012 trillion, a jump of more than $30 billion in just this month. The national debt has been rising at a faster rate following the passage of President Donald Trump’s $1.5 trillion tax-cut package a little more than a year ago and as the result of congressional efforts to increase spending on domestic and military programs. The nation has added more than $1 trillion in debt in the last 11 months alone.

Name:	Carlson -	Reply
Subject:	Out Of Control
Date:	2/13/2019 8:22:47 AM

Let the kids pay it off! dont worry be happy!

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Economic illiteracy and faux outrage
Date:	2/13/2019 8:30:04 AM

And yet they have collected record revenues to the Treasury as a result of increased economic activity. 

It's a spending problem, not a revenue problem.  And almost 70% of govt spending is for entitlements of which no one seems to be willing to do anything and for good reason.  Any time they mention the idea Democrats and the govt media (I repeat myself) start to tell the public the GOP wants to shove Granny over a cliff.  And of course much of the additional debt is interest expense from the prior debt.  In 2015 that number was around $230B or 6% of the total spending.  In 2018 it was projected to be close to $400B which is 16% of total spending and is overwhelmingly a result of dets wracked up prior to Trump.  So basically around 86% of the total spending by govt is totally out of the control of the President.  In reality, discretionary spending under Trump has actually gone down but it was overtaken by the additional interest expense.

And remember, one President alone in a mere 8 years presided over 36% of the additional debt.  Just think about it.  He presided over 3% of the entire history of this country but added 36% of the debt.  Funny but I never heard a whimper out of you during those 8 years about deficits but now it's suddenly a big deal?!?!?  Economics Goofy, learn something and it will help you in making educated posts.  

Name:	phil -	Reply
Subject:	Out Of Control
Date:	2/13/2019 8:55:12 AM (updated 2/13/2019 8:57:32 AM)

Well dont worry the green dream with destroy the economy and bankrupt everyone as you retrofit your home, purchase all new vehicles, New England will have to find new ways to heat their homes, free money to those who do not want to work, free education, free healthcare and open borders, energy costs go though the roof as all fossil fuels are abandoned in 10years for 100 renewable - and shut down those nuke plants!!!  All while just printing money, so that way there is no debt.... Just think of what you can do wth unlimited printing!!!!

We too can be Venezuela!  

Name:	Buteye -	Reply
Subject:	Out Of Control
Date:	2/13/2019 12:23:40 PM (updated 2/13/2019 12:48:08 PM)

Exactly. The United States would be another "Venezuela" but the results would be even more "colossal". Why don't all these "geniuses" perform the "job" for which they were elected? This "pie in the sky" mentality is showing the "world" what idiots the leftist Democraps are sending to Congress to represent the voice of the American people.

Name:	phil -	Reply
Subject:	Out Of Control
Date:	2/13/2019 1:04:19 PM

But it might work here when it has failed every where else in the world.....  We just havent went far enough left yet... /s

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	Out Of Control......MM
Date:	2/13/2019 9:07:21 PM

But, the Right is for fiscal conservatism. Ryan was the policy man for balancing the budget with elaborate plans and had control of the House and they passed a reduction of taxes without the necessry offset of expenditures.

Obama was funding the recovery from Bush and paying off the debt from the wars. The country expected the Right would change things. They haven't  and your defense is weak. Only idiots would not incorporate a projected increase in interest rates when reducing taxes. To calculate future deficits with interest rates so low one must project an increase in interest rates going forward.

I was quiet during the Obama years and you did a good job reminding us.

Now, tell why the Right did not project an increase in interest rates? Remember, the reduction was to get the economy to grow. Growth brings higher rates. The blame is not higher intrerent expense...the blame is incompetance from Treasury and the Budget team. The leader of the Treasury and Trump's Chief of Staff share the blame.

Name:	architect -	Reply
Subject:	Economic illiteracy and faux outrage and stupidity
Date:	2/13/2019 10:35:31 PM

If MM thinks anybody with an IQ above their hat size can't see the balderdash in his argument he is not the brightest porch light on the block.  Is it reality to compare the budgetary statistics in 8 years of a president who served in the 21st century in a nation of 330 million with past presidents as if those past president also served a nation which ALWAYS had 330 million?  Abe Lincoln, by percentage, increased the the debt almost as much in 4 years as Obama did in 8...sure he was fighting a justified war but he was also leading a nation of only 22 million if you don't count the states in rebellion! MM, compare apples with apples if you want to make an honest argument!

Name:	architect -	Reply
Subject:	UPDATE
Date:	2/13/2019 10:52:04 PM

After a little research I find it's evan worse tha MM claims:

Debt percentage increase since 1980:

  Trump............30%  (4 year estimate)

  Obama...........74%  (8 years)

  W.................101% (8 years)

  Clinton...........32%  (8 years)

  GHW Bush......54%  (4 years)

  Reagan..........186% (8 years)

Now MM, lets hear you rage against Messers Bush, Bush and Reagan the way you did against Obama

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Out Of Control.....Socialist Democrats like Goofy
Date:	2/14/2019 9:10:09 AM

So you are basically saying that they should have projected what interest rates will do.  Well let me explain something to you Goofy, if they have that kind of omniscience I doubt any of them would need a job in the govt.  But of course you ignored all my salient points and simply whined that they should have known it was going to happen.  I actually feel sorry for you on that note Goofy.  Going through life in a state of delusion is no way to live.

Having said that, I do agree that neither party is very good on govt spending.  The GOP is only incrementally better....but they are better and I shudder to think what spending would be like if Shrillery were POTUS and the Dems controlled Congress.  Oh wait, we saw that early in Odipsh!t's first term and we got Obamadon'tcare and eventually another $8T in new debt.  And we saw what happened after that with govt at all levels.  This is why I am for limited govt and subsidiarity.  Sadly, the train has left the station so all we can hope for is to somehow slow the trajectory and on that note the GOP is better than any Democrat, especially given their lurch toward socialism. 

Name:	phil -	Reply
Subject:	Out Of Control.....Socialist Democrats like Goofy
Date:	2/14/2019 10:14:09 AM

When did the train leave the station ?  I thought California scrapped the bullet train.

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Out Of Control.....Socialist Democrats like Goofy
Date:	2/14/2019 1:46:28 PM

Sadly I was referring to the big govt train.  When 85% of the federal budget is untouchable there is very little we can do to control spending in any meaningful way.  Until the American public cares more about what they do to their children and grandchildren this slow, inexorable move to socialism-lite will continue.  We may have occasional breaks in the trajectory but like the stock market used to do, it will grow over time.  Every time the left succeeds in getting something enacted like Obamadon'tcare, it quickly morphs into and untouchable entitlement.  And like the high speed rail in CA, it will be to nowhere, cost way more than projected and so on.......

Name:	phil -	Reply
Subject:	Out Of Control.....Socialist Democrats like Goofy
Date:	2/14/2019 2:22:41 PM

Oh I know i was being funny with the HS train comments - again sadly the big government / socialist train left the station a long time ago and i think GF and Archie are are either driving the train or at least cheerleading it.

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Out Of Control.....Socialist Democrats like Goofy
Date:	2/14/2019 2:56:13 PM

I knew you knew.....but our left wing nuts need it spelled out real slowly or it goes over their heads.

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	Out Of Control.....Blind Republicans Like MM
Date:	2/14/2019 9:21:24 PM

Interest rates were increased in 2016 and 2017 with 4 projected for 2018. It was NO secret. You just can't face the truth...They should have factored the increases into the tax rate reduction. If they did, they did a lousy job. If they didn't, they are typical Republicans...LIARS. Take you pick.....

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Out Of Control.....Wrong again Goofy
Date:	2/15/2019 4:09:29 PM

And yet the markets don't react until the hikes happen.  Projected being the key word here Goofy.  That the economy did so well that they actually had to pull the trigger is a testament to Trump's policies.  You see, as of 2018 they projected four additional increases in 2019 and now it's down to two and that is even open to change.  So no, none of them can be expected to see into the future.  Regardless, discretionary spending went down, otherwise the deficit would have been even worse.

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	Wrong again Goofy Only In Your Dreams
Date:	2/16/2019 1:07:51 AM (updated 2/16/2019 1:09:45 AM)

"Projected being the key word here Goofy.  That the economy did so well that they actually had to pull the trigger is a testament to Trump's policies.  You see, as of 2018 they projected four additional increases in 2019 and now it's down to two and that is even open to change."

Economics is projection about the future. If you and I had a meeting to discuss a tax reduction and its effect on the economy and deficit, you would argue supply economics. Reduce taxes and watch the economy grow...The economy under Trump has grown... now why not project increased interest rates if the economy is projected to grow? That's just basic economics. Afterall, as you like to remind us the decifit is due in large part due to the increased interest on the debt. The Right is now becoming the party of crooks and deficits.

It was so much easier for you and your puppets when the Dems were in control. Tough trying to make crooks and liars look good......

PS Did Arch finally wear you down?

Cheers

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Wrong again Goofy Only In Your Dreams
Date:	2/18/2019 8:26:33 AM

No, I actually never said the deficit is primarily due to the additional interest expense.  Read it again Goofy, over 2/3rds of our annual spending is from entitlement programs.  Under Trump discretionary spending went down.  

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Did you guess this one Goofy?
Date:	2/19/2019 3:43:16 PM

So now, despite having signaled that there would be two more increases in 2019, the Fed is signaling that rates are in a neutral position and no hikes are anticipated for the year.  Gee Goofy, I thought these projections were set in stone and never change?!?!?!?  It must really suck to be you and have reality bite you in the arse every time.