Name:	Carlson -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/10/2019 9:04:01 PM

with two inboard power plants pushing 500 hp each, is it legal on lake Martin?  If from out of state purchase, who polices that boat in a wet slip in a marina?  Am I mistaken that the law prohibits boat of that size on Lake Martin?  Thanks

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/10/2019 9:49:33 PM

Not legal.

Name:	Wood guy -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/10/2019 10:13:17 PM

The “ Three lake rule” boats cannot be longer than 30’6” and be capable of greater than 60 mph. There is plenty 35’ Searay and Cobalt 

boats on the lake that fit the 30’6” rule. 

Name:	lakngulf -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/10/2019 10:23:27 PM

Seems I remember a lot of boats already docked were grandfathered in

Name:	wix -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/10/2019 10:34:23 PM

Why don’t you notify marine police and let them check out the boat.  Boat sounds like ‘go-fast’ which would definitely go over the legal 60 mph, with those motors.

Name:	slowtimer -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/11/2019 11:55:34 AM

It's very difficult question to answer.  The way the law is written there are so many inaccuracies and loopholes that it is almost impossible to get a correct answer.  Do you measure the waterline of the boat or the LOA?    These are two drastically different measurments.  Also, the law states that if a boat is capable of over 60 mph as stated by the manufacture.  First off, most of the go fast manufactures went out of business in the 2008-2010 recession so there is nobody to ask.  Secondly, no manufacture has ever stated that a boat is capable of a certain speed.  There are so many variables in what a boat is capable of (trim, prop, weight, motor modifications, etc).  If someone wanted to put a big enough engine on 35' rowboat it would go over 60 mph but no manufacture would ever build one (somebody in their backyard might).  

What if your boat is 30' 1" (the law states anything over 30'6 is not allowed without a permit) and you have two sets of props for the 500's.  One set is shorter and only allows the boat to run a top speed of 59 mph.  The other set are taller props and they allow it to top out at 80 mph.  With one set, your boat is not capable of over 60 mph but with the other set it is.  Same boat, same power, same sound.  In one moment your boat would be considered legal but put it on a trailer and change the props and now the boat is illegal.  If a manufacture is still in business then they could write a letter stating that the boat is not capable of 60 mph with the smaller props.  Is it then legal?   

As you can see, I hate this law because it doesnt make any sence.  If you want to restrict speed then make a speed limit on the lake.  Don't pick and choose things to ban and do it with language that is not specific.  There is way too much left up to interpretation of the law and well meaning people who try to follow the law can get in trouble.  

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/12/2019 1:52:25 PM (updated 6/12/2019 2:03:28 PM)

As I read it, permits for boats over 30.6 that were on the lake or for sale pror to July 2006 excluding boats over 26'11" capable of over 60mph. They measure in a straight line from bow to stern.

2009 Alabama Code
Title 33 — NAVIGATION AND WATERCOURSES.
Chapter 6A — Recreational Vessel and Residence Boat Sewage Discharges Regulated.
Section 33-6A-3.1 Use on specified lakes of houseboats, vessels of large size, and vessels with certain speed ratings.

Section 33-6A-3.1

Use on specified lakes of houseboats, vessels of large size, and vessels with certain speed ratings.

(a) The prohibitions in this section shall apply only to the following lakes: Lake Harris (Lake Wedowee), Lake Martin, and Weiss Lake.

(1) Except as authorized under subsection (d), beginning July 1, 2007, the use of houseboats shall be prohibited. The term houseboat shall include any residence boat as defined in subdivision (6) of Section 33-6A-1 or any recreational vessel that constitutes a fully equipped dwelling similar in content to a mobile home, with a marine sanitation device, galley, and sleeping quarters.

(2) Beginning October 1, 2006, the use of recreational vessels greater than 26 feet 11 inches in length and rated by the manufacturer for or capable of a top speed in excess of 60 miles an hour shall be prohibited.

(3) Except as authorized under subsection (d), beginning July 1, 2007, the use of recreational vessels greater than 30 feet 6 inches in length, as determined by the straight line distance between the ends of the boat, excluding bowsprits, outboard motor brackets, rudders, or other attachments, shall be prohibited.

(b) Vessels used for law enforcement, public safety, search and rescue, scientific research, or dam operation or maintenance or medical vessels shall be excluded from the prohibitions in this section.

(c) Sailboats equipped with a mast and sails that are dependent upon the wind for propulsion in the normal course of operation shall be excluded from the prohibitions in this section.

(d) The department shall adopt rules pursuant to the Alabama Administrative Procedure Act within six months of July 1, 2006, authorizing the use of vessels otherwise prohibited by this section in the following circumstances:

(1) Vessels needed for use on a temporary basis.

(2) Houseboats that were licensed and in use on July 1, 2006, provided, that they meet all applicable standards for sewage discharges, are moored at a marina or other facility with a certified pump-out station or other approved means of sewage disposal, and are inspected annually.

(3) Boats exceeding 30 feet 6 inches in length not to include any boat covered by subdivision (2) of subsection (a) that was licensed and in use or that was on site and available for sale at a marina located on one of the lakes referenced in subsection (a) on July 1, 2006.

(e) A permit issued under subsection (d) shall specify the lake where continued use of the vessel is authorized and shall not be transferable to any other lake referenced in subsection (a). Each permit issued under subsection (d) shall have a term of one year and shall be issued on or after the annual inspection of the vessel, if required. The department may charge and collect a fee sufficient to cover the reasonable anticipated costs for annual inspections and permit issuance under subsection (d).

(Act 2006-398, p. 1004, §1.)

Name:	HARRY -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/12/2019 5:30:23 PM

Sounds fairly clear to me

Name:	Shortbus -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/12/2019 7:11:59 PM

So you can do anything you want in your 50 foot sailboat?

Name:	slowtimer -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/12/2019 9:33:11 PM

Section 2 is not realistic.  This is the section that pertains to performance boats.  No manufacturer that I have ever seen has ever certified or stated a boat is capable of a top speed.  They have stated a max HP.  Every boat ever manufactured is capable of greater than 60 mph.  It depends on what motor is in or on it, prop selection for acceleration or top speed, etc.  If a 30’ performance boat has a set of props that only allow it to go 59 mph is it then legal?  What if the top speed props are only used off of lake Martin?  The boat would not then be capable of over 60 mph with the equipment that is running on the lake.  Seems pretty grey to me.  

In my opinion, the law just doesn’t make sense.  If you want to keep speeds down then place a speed limit on the lake.  

Name:	HARRY -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/12/2019 10:41:59 PM

In theory you may be right but no one has ever ever put props on a dual engine go fast boat to slow it down. If it is over the length limit as spelled out clearly above and has two very big and very loud engines it is illegal on Martin.

Name:	slowtimer -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/12/2019 11:05:29 PM

I disagree.  You cannot just claim something illegal.  Only a judge has that right to interpret a law.

Many people put lower pitch props on their boats to increase acceleration.  It's the same theory as putting a lower gear ratio in a drag racing car.  It helps the car and boat jump out of the hole.  Plus, why wouldn't someone have a spare set of props so he or she can drive the boat on the lake?  Use the other props if they take it to another lake.  I have a 23' pontoon with a 140 hp motor on it so I don't have a dog in this fight but it just doesn't seem right to me the way the law is written. 

What if I had a 27' pontoon boat with a 300 on it.  That can go over 60 mph so by the law it would be illegal but probably never pulled over because it's just a quiet pontoon boat.  The 30' go fast boat that only does 59 mph would be legal but a lot of people would want it banned because it looks and sounds fast.  

Name:	HARRY -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/13/2019 8:18:41 AM

Thanks for the lesson on props. I simply am saying that no one will ever do anything to slow down a go fast boat. Just does not happen.

Name:	slowtimer -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/13/2019 9:57:53 AM

If I had a boat like that I would absolutely have a spare set of props so I could legally drive it on my home lake.  It would only take about a minute to change them out if I took it to a different lake.  It's a cheap and easy way to be legal it seems like.  It's just like someone who has a street legal race car.  They have a muffler to put on it when they drive it in the street to meet sound ordinances.  The muffler gets removed at a race track.  

I believe there is already a state law that restricts boat exhaust decibels.  They make mufflers for the performance boats so that should eliminate the sound concern.  Now we are just left with people complaining about a specific type of boat because they either have an immediate negative opinion of them or they think they are unsafe.  Then we get into a situation where people get to restrict others rights because they don't like something.

  I'm a libertarian so I see the other side.  What if person A didn't like something that person B has and was able to get a law passed that bans what person B has.  Then what happens if person B gets some power and is able to get a law passed that bans something person A has.  Both

person A and B have now lost what they had and everybody else that is not involved now must abide by the new laws.  If it is not actually harming someone else then I don't see a reason to ban items just because some people don't like it.  

Name:	slowtimer -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/13/2019 9:57:55 AM

If I had a boat like that I would absolutely have a spare set of props so I could legally drive it on my home lake.  It would only take about a minute to change them out if I took it to a different lake.  It's a cheap and easy way to be legal it seems like.  It's just like someone who has a street legal race car.  They have a muffler to put on it when they drive it in the street to meet sound ordinances.  The muffler gets removed at a race track.  

I believe there is already a state law that restricts boat exhaust decibels.  They make mufflers for the performance boats so that should eliminate the sound concern.  Now we are just left with people complaining about a specific type of boat because they either have an immediate negative opinion of them or they think they are unsafe.  Then we get into a situation where people get to restrict others rights because they don't like something.

  I'm a libertarian so I see the other side.  What if person A didn't like something that person B has and was able to get a law passed that bans what person B has.  Then what happens if person B gets some power and is able to get a law passed that bans something person A has.  Both

person A and B have now lost what they had and everybody else that is not involved now must abide by the new laws.  If it is not actually harming someone else then I don't see a reason to ban items just because some people don't like it.  

Name:	HARRY -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/13/2019 10:25:02 PM

“If I had” is the key phrase. You are a pontoon boat guy. If you were a go fast boat guy you would never do anything to slow your boat.

Name:	slowtimer -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/13/2019 11:15:53 PM

You don't know me.  I am a performance car guy and have built and raced cars.  Just because I have a pontoon boat doesn't mean that I don't like speed.  If I had a performance boat I would absolutely spend a small amount of money on a (lake Martin) set of small props to keep the boat legal on the lake and I imagine many others would too.  It doesn't change anything but the speed and can be swapped out in a minute once the boat is on a trailer and on its way to another lake.  

Name:	Shortbus -	Reply
Subject:	Slowtimer out of beer
Date:	6/14/2019 5:12:09 AM

https://www.facebook.com/reelfishingbeast/videos/1517498841890402/

Name:	HP HQ -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/14/2019 12:40:54 PM

Just the dumbest law anyone could ever come up with, ever, period!!

Name:	Shortbus -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/14/2019 12:48:21 PM (updated 6/14/2019 12:50:23 PM)

So help me remember what the law was about?

a)   safety concerns of 60+ mph boats of large mass    (a 14 yr old on a 67 mph scooter is safe)   and/or

b)   waves     (kids in a wakeboat swamping your docked boat onto land is OK)

Name:	slowtimer -	Reply
Subject:	Slowtimer out of beer
Date:	6/14/2019 4:33:52 PM

That pontoon boat would be legal on Lake Martin!!!  It shows how absolutuly stupid and difficult to enforce this law is.  

Name:	HP HQ -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/14/2019 4:41:40 PM

Shortbus hell if I know? Hell if anyone knows? 

Name:	slowtimer -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/14/2019 4:51:17 PM

Big developer wanted to ban housboats on Lake Wedowee so it would not impact sales of his houses/condos.  He got with state Senator Dial to work up a law for that lake.  The AL Power president at the time didnt like performance boats so he and Ben Russell latched onto the draft law and made modifications with AL Power's lobbying power.  Originally it was supposed to include all non-navagitable waterways in the state but there was significant pushback from other politicians in different areas and would not have been passed.  The revised draft of the law then removed all other lakes but Weiss, Wedowee, and Martin.  By removing all other lakes the other representatives and senators didnt have a problem because the lakes were not in their districts.  It was then passed.  

Someone please explain to me how only 3 lakes are affected in this state law?  It seems that if it were a saftey, noise, or wake issue then all non-navigable state waterways would be subject to it...  In my opinion, this law stinks to high heaven

Name:	Carlson -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/14/2019 6:21:55 PM

I seem to remember the appearance of houseboats showing up around chimney rock and sewage being discharged due to a lack of availability of service facilities.  Actually scrushy power boat may have contributed to the speed portion.  He would periodically fly through the lake in his cigar boat.  But the houseboats were the major objection.  I was glad since they could have ruined our beautiful lake!  

Name:	Shortbus -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/14/2019 6:40:14 PM (updated 6/14/2019 6:50:33 PM)

I agree with the houseboats ban.  No reason to bring the Southeast Asia look to Martin.

A go fast boat has never bothered me.  Wake boats though................

Remember when we could get our finest floating law enforcement to answer our posts?

Don't we pay these folks?  Especially after my no mirror that I wouldn't use if I had it while pulling a skiier ticket.

The question stands:   How many times has this big boat law been enforced ?

Name:	Carlson -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/14/2019 6:47:46 PM

Well, at least the houseboats are gone!  

Name:	realfast64 -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/23/2019 9:38:49 PM

 I love it a law was written so we would not have a wave problem!  Look what we have now boat who's sole purpose is to make a big wake.  If it isn't big enough we can fill the boat with water and make it bigger!  Then if the wake is to flat or too skinny we can lower a apparatus behind the prop and there we go a MONSTER WAKE!  So much for the 2005 problem of shoreline errosion.  We are makeing big bucks, and by theway look out for the dual engine tritoons capable of speeds beyond 60 mph!  For the love of money we have another problem comming down the river.

Name:	slowtimer -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/24/2019 12:15:01 PM

Yep...  I spent a lot of time and money this winter under my dock to shore up the structure.  Waves from wakeboard/wakesurf boats have been getting really bad and pounding our dock to the point where the whole thing rocks back and forth from the wave action.  It should be good now.  Let's not ban wakeboard boats because we will end up in a wack-a-mole scenerio.  The people who have wakeboard boats now will just move onto something else that could possibly be worse.  

Guess what people...  A lot of the people who had Cigarette boats and had to remove them from the lake are the same people who now have wakeboard boats.  Which is more damaging???  Cigarette boats don't make much of a wake at all if they are driving like they are supposed to be.  Cigarette boats are not designed to slowly plow through the water.  They are designed to ride on top of the water as efficiently as possible.  This design by nature reduces the wake size.  The more you plow in the water the bigger your waves are which is exactly what wakeboard boats are designed to do.

I got passed by two twin engine pontoon boats going over 60 mph this weekend.  They were in the 27-30' range and were running great and packing air like a cat boat.  They were running on the back 3'-4' of pontoons.  One even had the boat so dialed in it was throwing a rooster tail.  It's crazy to think a pontoon boat can do that and I loved watching them.  By the letter of the law, those boats are illegal but nobody cares because they are just quiet pontoon boats.  

Name:	slowtimer -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/24/2019 3:00:47 PM

I think the lake law needs to be removed.  It is now catching a lot of pontoon boats up in its wake (see below link as these pontoon boats would be illegal on lake Martin).  As technology progresses this law will become unenforcable.  It would be very similar to a local hypothetical law inacted 20 years ago banning any car capable of over 100 mph and over 250 HP.  You would effectively have banned (in a local area) new minivans, toyota camrys, every new pickup truck, and about 80% of all new vehicles produced.  This lake law doesnt make any sense and needs to be removed.

https://www.boatingmag.com/fast-pontoon-boats/

Name:	HARRY -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/24/2019 9:39:42 PM

Why should the law be removed just because now a rare pontoon boat or two meets the criteria of being illegal? If the law says over 30 ft. and over 60 mph or whatever pontoon boats aren’t exempt. JMO

Name:	slowtimer -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/25/2019 10:22:38 AM

Did you read the article I linked?  My whole point in posting it was to show that these new faster pontoon boats are becoming more commonplace in the industry.  Just like my example with the Toyota Camry, Minivans, and Pickup Trucks.  FYI, the law states anything over 26'11" and capable of over 60 mph is banned.  That does round up a lot of new pontoon boats that are on the lake currently.  I am not advocating removing those boats as they don't harm anybody or anything.  My whole point is to show how utterly stupid this law is and how it needs to be removed. 

Name:	HARRY -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/25/2019 11:10:16 AM

Becoming more commonplace does not warrant changing the law. Every car manufactured in the last seventy or more years will surpass interstate speed limits but that is no reason to change the law.

Name:	slowtimer -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/25/2019 11:26:38 AM

Like I said earlier, If a local law was passed 20 years ago stated that cars capable of over 100 mph and over 250 HP were banned would be very similar to this lake law that was passed in 2006.  It states that any boat over 26'11" and capable of over 60 is banned. Technological progress has been made and continues to be made in the automotive and marine industry.  I am fine with placing a speed limit on the lake if this current lake law is removed. 

Name:	slowtimer -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/25/2019 11:30:29 AM

If you drive around the lake you will notice a lot of new large pontoon boats with 300, 350, 400hp motors on them.  These are capable of over 60 mph.  What you are saying is that by keeping the law in place the marine police should go around to all of these peoples houses and make them remove their pontoon boats from the lake or face arrest.  This is what the law does...  

Name:	HARRY -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/25/2019 11:33:49 AM

Personally I don’t care but maybe they should. Just because people are buying illegal boats does not warrant changing the law.

Name:	slowtimer -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/25/2019 11:47:05 AM

I feel sorry for the marine police who try to enforce this law.  They don't have anyway to determine if a boat is "capable" of over 60 mph.  It may look fast, sound fast, but not be fast.  In another situation, a pontoon boat may look slow, and sound slow but be fast.  The law really needs to be removed and something better put in place.  A 60 mph speed limit would be much safer and actually be enforcible.  

Name:	realfast64 -	Reply
Subject:	Question: if someone brings a 30 foot boat
Date:	6/26/2019 9:14:38 PM

  The question is. Are people buying ilegal poontoon/tritoons, or MARINAS selling ilegal poontoon/tritoons?  I would say it is the latter!!