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| Name: |
CAT BOAT
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| Subject: |
This sounds kinda chitty...
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Date:
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10/30/2009 9:54:29 AM
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Pasted from aol news.
It is a sad day for the U.S. renewable energy business. A-Power Energy Generation Systems Ltd. (APWR), a Chinese producer of wind power turbines, has won the contract to provide turbines for one of the largest wind farms in America. The project, located in West Texas, will cost $1.5 billion, part of which will almost certainly be put up by Chinese banks. The company said that "Upon completion, it is anticipated to generate enough electricity for 180,000 homes in America."
According to a number of media sources, U.S. manufacturers of wind turbine components have had trouble getting financing during the recession. That means they had no realistic chance of bidding on the contract for the facility, which is expected to begin operating by 2011 and could create as many as 2,800 jobs.
The new Texas project shows the extent to which capital from the Chinese government allows companies in the world's most populous nation to develop and sell new technology, while in the U.S. the capital markets strangle opportunities for innovation. The U.S. may be the beneficiary of less expensive energy, but the money made off of the components is likely to be made by Chinese companies.
Wind farms are one of the largest renewable energy prospects of the future. Only a year ago, T. Boone Pickens attempted to build a massive wind farm in West Texas. The project faltered, apparently due to lack of funds. Part of the U.S. government's stimulus package might have gone to help U.S. suppliers to help build turbines for the project, but that did not happen.
The A-Power Energy deal is a sign that the campaign for America to rely less on fossil fuels is gaining some traction, but the tools to allow it to happen will be marked "made in China".
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| Name: |
lamont
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| Subject: |
Dang Cat......
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Date:
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10/30/2009 10:09:00 AM
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You need to quit being so political and controversial.
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| Name: |
Yankee06
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| Subject: |
Dang Cat......
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Date:
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10/30/2009 10:11:24 AM
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-you just can't make this stuff up!
-the old timers should recognze the following....
"We have met the enemy... and he is us"
-----From the foreword to The Pogo Papers, Copyright 1952-53
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| Name: |
CAT BOAT
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| Subject: |
Dang Lamont.....
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Date:
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10/30/2009 10:13:57 AM
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I was just reading some news and found that. I really would like to see a "reasonable" explaination as to how and why that should happen! I can't think of one....
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| Name: |
lamont
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| Subject: |
Nor I... NT
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Date:
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10/30/2009 10:15:59 AM
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| Name: |
CAT BOAT
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| Subject: |
ANYONE...
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Date:
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10/30/2009 2:46:39 PM
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No bashing. I am serious. A reasonable explaination. Surely someone has one. No I am not picking an argument, yall know me better than that. This just really has me puzzled!
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| Name: |
rude evin
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| Subject: |
ANYONE...
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Date:
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10/30/2009 3:34:14 PM
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It's a good question, and an area that I have no expertise in.....however I have an opinion that when boiled down to its simpliest terms says there are probably two or three good reasons for this: 1) the Chinese do not use the same profitability criteria as do American investors, they have other political considerations that will come into play, 2) In the past these kind of projects (wind, solar, etc.) have not shown the price per kwh generated to be competitive with that of a central generated power plant kwh, 3) Therefore they must be subsidised by gov't and have not been to a large extent, 4) These type investments generally require a long term horizon on the part of the investors and there just is not much faith that the subsidy committment will be there long term, 5) And finally, there is so much uncertainty in the investment climate caused by political upheavals that fear is causing even the larger banks to hoard their dollars rather than risk it too far into the future on iffy propositions. The Chinese will keep their people working, they will achieve a huge amount of bragging rights for this coup while they use their large surplus of dollars to invest in our economy which reduces their treasury holdings.......win/win/win...... On a similar subject, if you want to see the long range outlook and strategic nature of Chinese investors, you should go over to Grand Bahama Island (about 80 miles east of Ft Lauderdale) and check out the large, modern and efficient trans-shipment port that coupled with their control of both ends of the Panama Canal Zone and you will begin to wonder if they haven't outgunned us at the very game that American capitalism perfected...... Yeah, I know about opinions...........how are your Chinese language skills coming....lol
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| Name: |
Feb
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| Subject: |
ANYONE...
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Date:
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10/30/2009 6:59:18 PM
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I am not diagreeing with anyone on this issue. I would only ask a question: What is the difference between this and Mercedes Hyundai, Honda, Toyota, and the list could go on with their investments in the USA? (A lot of it is in Alabama.)
Maybe, my question is comparing apples to oranges. ??? I can not say or speculate with my absence of knowledge about this specfic endeavor.
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| Name: |
MAJ USA RET
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| Subject: |
Wind Farms
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Date:
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10/31/2009 9:22:46 AM
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Visit a wind farm before you buy into that process. They occupy huge parcels of the high ground. This is prime real estate… you’ll probably have to TAKE it via eminent domain. And it will be a prominent feature of sunrise for many and sunset for many others… who used to stand on their deck and admire the beauty of sunrise… or sunset.
In season, the ground beneath them is littered with dead migratory birds (we're on the Atlantic Flyway).
Are you a sailor? Have your read “Rhyme of the Ancient Mariner”? In the summer, when it’s hotter than heii here, how much do you long for a breeze? What powers your air conditioner, ceiling fans, refrigerator?
Is the total package worth the snobbish bragging rights? The liberals on Martha’s Vineyard said… of course… “NO!”
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| Name: |
Feb
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| Subject: |
Wind Farms
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Date:
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10/31/2009 11:52:36 AM
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Not a sailor. I was a ground pounder.
I am sure some of your points have merit, but I am not sure this was Cat's issue. I gathered his point dealt with a foreign country establishing a significant industrial enterprise in the USA.
I am sure there are some negative impacts to wind farms as you mentioned, but there is a significant negative about coal fired plants particularly here in Alabama. As a result of burning coal, Alabama has one of the highest levels of mercury in the US. There most likely are negatives to any and every source of power generation, but I don't think any of us are willing to suffer the alternative.
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| Name: |
MAJ USA RET
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| Subject: |
Wind Farms
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Date:
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10/31/2009 4:10:16 PM
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You're right. The REAL issue here is China.
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| Name: |
Feb
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| Subject: |
Wind Farms
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Date:
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10/31/2009 5:25:31 PM
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You are totally correct. The question is do we want them with us or against us.
Wind Turbine energy is no longer the technology we need to worry about. It may of been years ago, but we lost it through technolgy transfer years ago. You as one of the military, should know what we now have to worry about.
By the way, what is your military background?
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| Name: |
Feb
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| Subject: |
This sounds kinda chitty...
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Date:
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10/31/2009 9:12:44 PM
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OK Cat, Did you receive sufficient responses? What are your thoughts now? I bet they are the same as mine now - "Chitty" as you would put it.
Now where is the Bang -- Bang (Chitty- Chitty - Bang - Bang) LOL
Now, you have names for some of the ducks.
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| Name: |
Procraft176
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| Subject: |
This sounds kinda chitty...
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Date:
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10/31/2009 9:52:18 PM
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Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe the good book mentions two countries at the end of time.One is Russia and the other is China.(Hmmmm.....) If this is correct Someone better wake up and smell the coffee.
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| Name: |
Feb
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| Subject: |
This sounds kinda chitty...
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Date:
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10/31/2009 10:06:37 PM
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Oh my goodness. Where does it state such in the good book?
You have to be chitting us. I don't think either country is mentioned in the good book I have. LOL
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| Name: |
CAT BOAT
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| Subject: |
This sounds kinda chitty...
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Date:
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10/31/2009 10:34:23 PM
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FEB, I really was not looking for any particular response. Just some reasonable explaination as to "why". If I understand it right, we are putting taxpayer $$$ into re-newable energy resources. But, it seems like this time the $$$ went to a company in China. Maybe I am too simple minded, but that just don't seem right. Then again, I was with perfectly calm, quite, nice, working and seemingly simple minded folks Friday night at a Chicken Auction. Myself, and everyone else was as happy and thankful as can be. I was just curious as to what others would think and say. I don't think I could ever find or read an answer that would even come close to explaining the contract to China company acrticle. But, then again, I am no political expert, but I sometimes enjoy this part of the forum. You have to admit however, there is no "plauseable" explaination thus far!
Cathouse Marine and Chicken Condo Builders
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| Name: |
Feb
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| Subject: |
This sounds kinda chitty...
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Date:
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10/31/2009 11:53:06 PM
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Like I said before, Cat I agree.
Do you see a comparrison between auto overseas owned autoplants moving/moved into the USA. I imagine Toyota, Honda, Mercedes, BMw and Huyndia make the windmill deal look like small potatoes.
Of course, lets hope all bring jobs and are there any that do not do so?
As of last week, I no longer own a Honda auto. This is a first for us in 25 years. They are great cars. I now own to Ford products.
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| Name: |
CAT BOAT
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| Subject: |
This sounds kinda chitty...
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Date:
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11/1/2009 11:20:20 AM
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I am not found of the overseas auto companies building here, but GM sells many vehicles overseas. You should have called me and bought a Chevy. I need a stimulus check. ;)
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| Name: |
Yankee06
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| Subject: |
This sounds kinda chitty...
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Date:
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11/1/2009 5:54:44 PM
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In 40 years of driving I've never owned a foreign car.
-When discussing economics with my liberal friends, they always get into supporting workers, etc. All I ever have to say is, "hmmmm, that sounds good; by the way, what kind of car do you drive?"
-There is very little good about foreign car plants in the US. Yes, they provide jobs (jobs that US car companies use to provide); yes they solidify foreign relations (and solidify our short end of the trade deficit). These companies use us like a third world country for cheap labor. But what's worse, the profit goes back to their countries to be invested in their schools, infrastructure, and social improvements. Worse, we are not developing innovations in those manufacturing areas; they are. Even worse, we are not developing a management class, they are. We are developing a cheap labor work force, or a high-wage welfare force.
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| Name: |
MAJ USA RET
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| Subject: |
This sounds kinda chitty...
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Date:
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11/2/2009 9:43:04 AM
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A person (or entity) has a right to recognize a profitable business opportunity and legally exploit it. Our labor unions and auto manufacturing upper management failed to serve up (in order) quality and value.
Notice that the foreign automakers prefer states with right-to-work laws. The foreign automakers can simply move out if the unions move in and create an unprofitable situation. Quality decisions are reserved for the home office and instructions are pushed downward.
American workers will choose jobs over union membership. American consumers will (eventually) switch to quality over loyalty.
I want to buy American. The reason I drive Japanese cares is a quality decision preceded by consistently poor experience with American made cars and trucks.
In the future, if I wish to drive an American car or truck, it will have to be a Ford. I don’t really believe I will be satisfied with a vehicle made by the management of Freddie Mac, Social Security, or the Post Office.
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