| Name: |
bhamanx
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| Subject: |
Boats Inside Needles Eye/Chapman Creek
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Date:
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6/21/2010 12:18:09 PM
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The slough inside Needles Eye adjacent to the Parker Creek area of Lake Martin is a unique body of water in that it is the one location on Lake Martin that comes closest to being a separate body of water…i.e. a lake in and of itself, almost separate from the rest of Lake Martin. The small opening at Needle’s eye and the size of the body of water in the area called Chapman Creek attracts a lot of boaters who are drawn into the area by the mere name “Needle’s Eye”. Many boater’s come into Chapman creek to ski and wake-board because they want a quiet, calm body of water to practice their sport. When this happens, this body of water is anything but calm and quiet. Of particular impact to the calmness of this sough are the deep ruddered boats (primarily the deck boats with the I/O ruddered motors). These boats create a powerful wake. When the waves they create reach the shores and the numerous piers and seawalls of the Chapman Creek residents, their impact is like a small tidal wave. It is not possible to stand on a floating dock when such waves come through. Trying to board a boat during one of these waves hits is nearly impossible and is down right dangerous. The impact of these waves on the shore, and particularly the seawalls, takes it’s toll in damage and wear and tear. Chapman Creek slough is simply too narrow and is not able to withstand the powerful energy and displaced water created by such boats. If this body of water was a contained private lake (it pretty much is as described above), large boats would not be allowed…and if allowed would be required to travel at wake speed only. ANY SUGGESTIONS ON HOW TO CHANGE THIS ARE WELCOMED
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| Name: |
DaBurglar
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| Subject: |
Its not just Needles Eye
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Date:
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6/21/2010 1:30:48 PM
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Good luck my freind...
Your not the only person with this problem. Shady Point (north of River Bridge) takes a beating every weekend. What is even worse is that they come 25 feet from your dock spewing a 4 ft wake and waving at you like they have know idea what they are doing. I used to think my brother was just going on and on for no reason but, now its starting to get to me. I am not sure how much my wall can stand and when I have to repair it I may have to pay Alabama Power for a permit that is not cheap. (I heard someone paid $250 for a floating dock permit).
Seems the boaters win, the gas stations win, Alabama Power wins but as a lake lot owner we lose.
At least I get to vent on here today huh? I would like to hear others thoughts and do we have a solution to the problem?
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| Name: |
jwh445
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| Subject: |
Its not just Needles Eye
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Date:
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6/21/2010 2:32:58 PM
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Sell high in the Lake Martin area and buy low on the Gulf coast. There is not much boat traffic, and usually nature's shoreline absorbs most of the wave action. Just a thought.
Does anyone know the actual law, as to how close you can come to someones pier, while towing a skier, or on a plane?
I agree with the above poster, this happens everywhere.
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| Name: |
Pontoon
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| Subject: |
LOL TEAR DOWN YOUR SEAWALLS
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Date:
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6/21/2010 2:54:51 PM
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Needles Eye, Chapmans Landing, and boats were there first
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| Name: |
lovelml
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| Subject: |
Boats Inside Needles Eye/Chapman Creek
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Date:
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6/21/2010 3:00:47 PM
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Talk to the water patrol in Alex city to find out what you need to do to get idle speed bouys put out. There is a law regarding to how close skiers etc., are allowed to ones piers. Again, check with the water patrol, they have all the information.
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| Name: |
Talullahhound
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| Subject: |
Boats Inside Needles Eye/Chapman Creek
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Date:
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6/21/2010 3:25:00 PM
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If people would use common sense and a bit of coutesy, it would be less of a problem. I'm not sure why people seem to think that it is okay to zoom down sloughs when there is so much open water on which to run their boats at a good speed.
Yes, the boaters were here first, and the fishermen, but it's not necessarily a "here first" proposition now that the lake is more populated. I'm not sure why, but it seems to me that a lot of people have this attitude that "it is the lake, and I should be able to just do whatever I want". More of the "me first" attitude that has taken hold in our country.
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
Boats Inside Needles Eye/Chapman Creek
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Date:
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6/21/2010 5:05:08 PM
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Unfortunately, Alabama has no law or regulation that restricts the speed of boats or the amount of wake allowed by boats in any condition or location in the State. The "proximity law" , which would have restricted speeds and wakes in close proximity of docks, property, and other boaters, was under consideration by the Dept of Conservation and Natural Resources, but was lobbied out of existance by the bass fishing clubs. DCNR Commissioner Lawley, has said no attempt will be made to institute a similar law until there is a new Governor and since Lawley is a political appointee he will probably leave also. Many states have proximity laws and Alabama can enjoy the safety of such a law, if people want it bad enough to get involved.
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| Name: |
Pontoon
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| Subject: |
ANOTHER NEWBIE -COMPLAINT
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Date:
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6/21/2010 5:24:04 PM
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| Name: |
8hcap
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| Subject: |
Boats Inside Needles Eye/Chapman Creek
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Date:
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6/21/2010 5:37:09 PM
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What you describe is a problem but it is part of lake living. We live on a long slough that is very conducive to wake boarders - those boats produce the most "wake". Can I require that they go to some other part of the lake? No.
The waters of the lake are public access - means just waht it says.
If you were to receive permission for the right to close the Eye of the needle then would it not work both ways?
8
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| Name: |
bhamanx
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| Subject: |
ANOTHER NEWBIE -COMPLAINT
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Date:
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6/21/2010 5:41:38 PM
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Been on the lake since 1975...property owner since 1997. Just trying to get something done. I have some other ideas....just looking to see what else has been done before implementing my own.....obviously not much solid has been done so far....
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| Name: |
bhamanx
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| Subject: |
Boats Inside Needles Eye/Chapman Creek
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Date:
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6/21/2010 5:44:13 PM
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Not trying to close needles eye...no wake zone would be nice...just looking to see what other ideas are out there..I have other ideas and plans....just trying to see what others have to say....
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| Name: |
bhamanx
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| Subject: |
Boats Inside Needles Eye/Chapman Creek
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Date:
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6/21/2010 5:47:33 PM
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Thank you for your refreshing positive reply...
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| Name: |
Maverick
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| Subject: |
Boats Inside Needles Eye/Chapman Creek
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Date:
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6/21/2010 6:08:22 PM
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If I am not mistake you can place a markers (not buoys) 100' from your shoreline or maybe the end of your pier to mark off a swim area. I have seen folks use both boat fenders and swim noodles to mark such. But again I would seek the advice of the Marine Patrol to ensure you are in compliance as not 100% sure it is 100'.
Also just another thought have have seen a couple of neighborhoods in narrow sloughs where most of the neighbors have place NO WAKE signs in their yards or on their piers, not sure if legal or not so again I would seek the advice of the Marine Patrol.
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| Name: |
Mack
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| Subject: |
Boats Inside Needles Eye/Chapman Creek
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Date:
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6/21/2010 6:14:39 PM
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My boat is not so large, 22' I/O and weighs about 3000 pounds. But, I can still put the stern down hard/stick the nose high in the air, throttle down and throw an impressive wake at your dock.
More often than not, as others have said, it is MAINLY the DRIVER creating the problem, not necessarily the boat alone. A 30' 10,000 pound cruiser can be operated in a narrow waterway with very little wake, right? The choice depends on the
attitude of the driver.
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| Name: |
Mack
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| Subject: |
Its not just Needles Eye
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Date:
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6/21/2010 6:24:12 PM
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A freon gas horn really helps sometimes, to get the driver's attention, along with a one-finger salute.
Failing that, my Grand Daddy would have taken the driver behind the woodshed with a razor strop for follow-up treatment of his Attention Deficit Disorder.
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| Name: |
mariah1
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| Subject: |
Boats Inside Needles Eye/Chapman Creek
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Date:
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6/21/2010 6:36:26 PM
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The only thing the water patrol has ever told me is IF they damage my boat or peer that if I get their registration number on their boat they will find them and hold them responsible. But most times they are moving to fast for me to get that number.
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| Name: |
Talullahhound
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| Subject: |
Not another "newbie" complaint
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Date:
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6/21/2010 7:45:40 PM
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It's a valid property owner complaint. Maybe a "property owner" vs. "lake user" complaint. More of the "it's the lake, I should be able to do whatever I want" attitude.
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| Name: |
Lifer
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| Subject: |
Because they can...
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Date:
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6/21/2010 8:04:54 PM
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... pretty much do whatever they want. I am always amazed at folks that buy lake property and complain about waves. I can assure that a NO WAKE bouy will NOT be placed there. I used to ski, kneeboard, tube etc. there as far back as the 70's. The very back end of the creek is probably the best ski site on the lake. And Mav is right about placing swimmers bouys, but it is NOT 100ft. In most of that creek that would be all the way across. In most cases you are a allowed up to, but never to exceed 1/3 the distance accross. That leaves 1/3 for the other proerty owners and one third for traffic.
Any boater that makes a wake that casues damage is responsable for that damage. Irrating home owners in NOT damage.
Is the rope swing still up?
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| Name: |
Ulysses E. McGill
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| Subject: |
Boats Inside Needles Eye/Chapman Creek
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Date:
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6/21/2010 8:50:10 PM
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Wakes and waves are part of life on the Lake....we all knew that when we bought property unless we had blinders on.
However, should people be buzzing your dock with a boat or jet ski? no. Should they keep a reasonable distance? yes. I think a 100 foot law for anything over idle is reasonable, but that is not the law. The MP has the ability to enforce judgment calls on reckless operation, but typically a perturbed property owner will be far more stringent in their interpretation of such than an unbiased onlooker (such as the Marine Police). Even with a 100 foot idle law, wakes will still effect most people on the lake and should be expected and planned for in pier and sea wall construction.
Like 8 said, it's a public lake. When one chooses to live on a lake, golf course, or other desirable public area, they must be willing to accept the good with what they may consider bad.
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| Name: |
Tarpon
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| Subject: |
Boats Inside Needles Eye/Chapman Creek
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Date:
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6/21/2010 9:22:48 PM
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There are people who own boats and there are boaters. Unfortunately, there are far more of the former than there are of the latter.
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| Name: |
CAT BOAT
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| Subject: |
Well, Now what...????
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Date:
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6/21/2010 10:45:31 PM
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I can't even come there with my boat. AND I NEVER MADE A WAVE at your pier! just a vent from CAT is all this is. Sorry.
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| Name: |
Samdog
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| Subject: |
Boats Inside Needles Eye/Chapman Creek
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Date:
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6/21/2010 11:07:07 PM
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That's a rather large area of water. Are you sure all of the property owners in there would want a idle only rule? If I lived in there I would not. BTW, the slough where my cabin is has plenty of rude boaters so I am not uninformed.
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| Name: |
Pontoonfisher
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| Subject: |
Call Cat about the tater gun
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Date:
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6/22/2010 7:28:15 AM
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I would call Cat and see where you can get your hands on that sweet tater gun he has access to. Sounds like a good oportunity for a little Idaho style target practice. Ka-twish!!!!
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| Name: |
Little Talisi
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| Subject: |
2 cents worth.............
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Date:
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6/22/2010 7:45:30 AM
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having been on the lake since the mid 60's and living here fulltime since the early 90's, I have seen the changes and often have to remind myself that they can be both good and bad. when I was teaching my children and others to ski, this quiet slough where we live was the perfect place to do it. I have to remind myself that the thoughts of disturbing others with our wakes was secondary. Now that others are doing the same I have to remember the fun that my children and guests had. The one thing that I remind myself of, is that the quiet days far outnumber the hectic ones greatly and I appreciate that.
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| Name: |
Kizma Anuice
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| Subject: |
COME OF THE POCKETBOOK
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Date:
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6/22/2010 8:55:42 AM
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Spend a little cash and build a good seawall and a good boat lift and sturdy dock with four point tie slips. I did this and now I like to see and hear the waves come crashing in. Makes me feel like I am living on a large body of water.
At the end of the day, I get a lot more wave action from storms. I have talked to APC and the Marine Police about getting a "NO STORM" zone set up but i guess it is tied up in red tape.
I am considering getting the Alabama Legislature to ban large and/or fast moving storms on Lake Martin.
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You have my permission bring the Cat Boat to my pier any time you want....if we do it on a Monday or Tuesday there won't be many folks around to notice and you should make a plastic mock-up of a Yamaha 150 to hang on the back for cover.
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I like a good thunderstorm.....However, if you want to work on banning hail and tornado's I may be able to support the issue.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Life on the lake
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Date:
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6/22/2010 9:25:07 AM
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I wasn't familiar with this area of Lake Martin so I found it on Google Earth. After measuring the length and width of the area I agree there is no way they will ever place No Wake buoys in there and if you lived far up that slough you sure wouldn't want to have to idle all the way in.
As for inconsiderate boaters my view is they are only inconsiderate if they come too close to the dock. Most parts of that slough are over 900 feet wide which is plenty big for skiing. However, it seems to me the problem would be partially self correcting because after a few passes they lose their quiet water and will probably go elsewhere. I would definitely put out some swim area buoys but not too far or the Marine Patrol will remove them. That will at least keep them away from your dock and resolve the safety issue.
Waves are a fact of life on a lake and it is incumbent on a property owner to design their seawall and docks to withstand the kind of waves they will experience. If you are sitting on water that is used for skiing and wakeboarding (and I envy you if you do) then you need to accept the fact that there will be waves, even if the boaters are considerate and stay a reasonable distance from your dock. I live in a slough and people zoom up, turn around and zoom out. I modified our dock and designed and built a floating dock that could withstand that type of activity.
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| Name: |
Pontoon
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| Subject: |
Sprayed every pier in "Dr. Bensons…
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Date:
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6/22/2010 10:57:25 AM
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almost every day in the summer from late 60's through the 70's,
all in fun, never a complaint. The only difference today, people
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| Name: |
Feb
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| Subject: |
Sprayed every pier in "Dr. Bensons…
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Date:
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6/22/2010 12:57:33 PM
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In other words - They were nice folks, and you were a total jerk with no regards to their property or their well being.
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| Name: |
Lifer
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| Subject: |
Feb it's called BEING A KID!!!!
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Date:
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6/22/2010 1:40:15 PM
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In my day we were allowed, even encouraged to do the things that kids did. I assure you I 'sprayed' many peir in my day also. Sometimes it might not work out so well, but it was still fun. And folks were just nicer back then. There were very few mini-mansions at that time. Most of the places were just 'cabins' and the weekend inhabitants were middle class working folks that didn't suffer from ME ME ME Disease so prevalant today.
I am too far away to do it myself, but I have several freinds still in that area, so I will have one come by and spray your peir so you won't feel so left out....lol.
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| Name: |
Talullahhound
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| Subject: |
Life on the lake
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Date:
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6/22/2010 1:49:52 PM
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I have a well built boathouse, my boats are on lifts when they are not in the water, and my seawall is new. Unfortunately my neighbors, all of whom are part-timers, don't have boathouses, so everytime a boat or jetski comes tearing into our slough, I can hear their boats being smashed into their docks.
Everyone on this board knows of some quiet sloughs that are wide that could be used for practicing wakeboarding, skiing and any other such activity. People like to ride up and down the sloughs to look at houses and landscaping and most people do it at a respectful speed that causes no damage at all. So why is it that some people can be respectful and courteous, and others can't? I don't know how you were raised, but I was raised to be respectful of others.
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| Name: |
Talullahhound
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| Subject: |
Feb it's called BEING A KID!!!!
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Date:
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6/22/2010 1:55:59 PM
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That's not being a kid. That's just being disrespectful of others.
You say the "ME, ME, ME" -- well what is your example? ME, ME, ME....It's the classic "I should be able to do whatever I want, wherever I want, whenever I want". And if that is not "ME, ME, ME" I surely don't know what is. There is plenty of open space on the lake for someone that wants to play, and not irritate others.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Why are you so nasty?
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Date:
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6/22/2010 2:34:57 PM
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I never defended people for being rude. I simply pointed out a fact of life living on a lake and it sounds to me like you are responsible while your neighbors either don't care about the waves or are not taking proper care of their property.
I was raised to respect others and teach my kids to be likewise. Last year someone that was skiing at the slalom course in Sandy Creek followed my kids (they were on jet skis) all the way home to compliment them for leaving the area of the slalom course when they came to ski it because they knew it would disturb the water. So don't bother lecturing me and accusing me of not being raised correctly because I point out the truth about lake living. And don't blame me if I accept the fact that there will be waves and act appropriately versus whining about it on the forum to people who likely don't act irresponsibly anyway.
Preaching to the choir may make you feel good but it doesn't resolve anything. If waves bother someone fix their property so it won't impact them. Complain to the MP if it makes you feel better. Blow horns, shake your fist, flip them the bird, do whatever makes you feel better. It doesn't bother me either way because I am not going to spend any mental energy worrying about a problem that I can't fix.
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| Name: |
Maddog
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| Subject: |
Feb it's called BEING A KID!!!!
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Date:
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6/22/2010 2:54:11 PM
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"hound......do you or have you ever had kids???
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| Name: |
Lifer
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| Subject: |
What he said!!
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Date:
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6/22/2010 3:09:07 PM
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She never ceases to amaze me. The area they built in has been a haven for skiiers long before they knew Lake Martin existed, but now that hound and feb are here they should all go away and find somewhere else to play.
ONce again I say, if you have watercraft it is YOUR responsibility to secure it in sucha way as to not get damamged by WAVES. Waves are inherint to water. They happen with or without boats on the water.
If it as bad as hound says it is, and my neighbors 'toys' were being damaged while I watched, I would be a good neighbor and record it for them so that they could seek legal redress. But I suspect that there hasn't been any damage to anything but hounds' peace and quiet. I don't know any stupid people who won lake homes so I am pretty sure those folks knew there would be waves when they bought the places.
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| Name: |
Talullahhound
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| Subject: |
Nasty???
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Date:
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6/22/2010 4:48:43 PM
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Sorry, I can't see how my pointing out that some people are courteous and others aren't is being nasty. It's just a fact of life.
But then, MM, I guess you know nasty much better than I do...
Lifer, I really cannot imagine how my slough would be a ski paradise, since it is a fairly short slough. Now, perhaps you are referring to the larger water area adjacent to my slough, and with that I quite agree. It would be a great place to ski and many people do. Funny, we get along well with all our neighbors, and yet you, who live on the other side of the lake from us and have never met us, are so sure we are bad people.
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| Name: |
lovelml
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| Subject: |
Nasty???
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Date:
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6/22/2010 5:17:22 PM
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I agree the lake is a place for fun, HOWEVER, when one lives in a relatively narrow slough and has seen jet skiers end up thrown onto piers, skiers hitting piers, boats going up on piers, several with severe injuries, some kids too scared to let their parents know, and our pontoon boat being thrown up on our pier by blithering idiots plowing thru the water, causing considerable damage and expense, 80% of our slough signed a petition to be allowed to place idle speed only bouys in the mouth.
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| Name: |
realfast64
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| Subject: |
Boats Inside Needles Eye/Chapman Creek
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Date:
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6/22/2010 9:38:18 PM
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Bull CRAP!! If you dig enough you will find that boaters are responsible for"their" wake. A well placed video camera or game camera will capture the law breakers and the pictures will prove their actions and will also help them realize what they are doing. You will be amazed how many live on the lake also. When they come by just follow them back to thier place and show them how they come by i doubt they have cameras. It worked for me but a trotline was involved. I still chuckle about the look on their face when explained what was about to happen if they didn't go back and tie my line back together!! The sad part was they were preachers!! Ha Ha!
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| Name: |
Lifer
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| Subject: |
80% huh?
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Date:
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6/23/2010 8:11:10 AM
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Well 100% will not be enough. Sign all the petitions you want, you ain't gonna get no bouy!!!!! End of story. Do you not think that EVERYONE would like to have a no wake bouy in thier slough!?!? I am absolutely certain that if the damage you describe had happened, some one would do SOMETHING constructive, instead of whining about it to others. Set up a video trap, report the criminal activity with video evidence and then file in civil court. But I repeat, I doubt it is as bad as all that. If it was my neighbors I would simply go over and pay a nice visit.
Remember, the only way to have a good neighbor, it to BE a good neighbor.
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| Name: |
Lifer
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| Subject: |
10+ years is enough
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Date:
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6/23/2010 8:14:04 AM
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After dealing with you and feb for over 10 years I know you both better than your neighbors. I can only imagine what those neighbors mumble to themselves as they walk away from one yours or febs visits.
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| Name: |
ecstasypoint
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| Subject: |
10+ years is enough
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Date:
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6/23/2010 10:06:43 AM
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Sorry Hound...(it's a little embarrassing to have us lake folks represented by L somewhere near the L.) The fact is laws can be changed when enough people want them to be. I believe that we will see restrictions on stupidity on the water before long. Until then we are stuck with stupid. Have a great summer.
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| Name: |
lovelml
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| Subject: |
80% huh?
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Date:
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6/23/2010 10:10:04 AM
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How dare you call me a liar.................. it is obvious from your retoric that you only believe in what you see and not what others have experienced. For your information,it was NOT the people in our slough that were injured and caused the damage. Please refrain from spouting off about things you have NO KNOWLEDGE of.
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| Name: |
Lifer
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| Subject: |
I don't represent anyone but myself.
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Date:
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6/23/2010 10:49:35 AM
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Unlike others I don't try to control, speak for, or represent anyone but myself. If you don't like it,try using the ignore button that feb begged for for two years and then refused to use, all the while claiming he did. Futhermore, if you look to any one person or orginazation to 'speak for you', then you need to grab a sack and start speaking for yourself.
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| Name: |
Talullahhound
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| Subject: |
Pardon me but
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Date:
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6/23/2010 6:30:33 PM
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You do not "know" Feb or me. We have never met. You have responded or initiated posts, which is a lot different than "knowing" someone. As they say, you don't know "Jack" about us other than some basic information that's available in the public domain.
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| Name: |
Lifer
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| Subject: |
You're pardoned, but your still wrong...
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Date:
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6/23/2010 7:15:52 PM
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Back in the early days your better half posted WAAAYYYYY to much imformation on this board. Not just me, but many others know LOTS about you guys.
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| Name: |
GoneFishin
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| Subject: |
Why So Personal???????
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Date:
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6/23/2010 7:59:24 PM
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This thread was posted seeking help in stopping waves near their home. Now, it has evolved into a personal attack by some. May I suggest that we let this thread die a natural death as the attacks serve no useful or positive purpose.
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| Name: |
Talullahhound
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| Subject: |
Amen to that
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Date:
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6/23/2010 8:53:36 PM
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and apologies to Bhamanx for the hijack of their thread.
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