| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Prediction about SCOTUS ruling today
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Date:
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6/28/2012 8:48:40 AM
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Here's mine. It will be 5-4 decision with them upholding most of the law but vacating the individual mandate which is not protected by the commerce clause.
What say you?
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| Name: |
MrHodja
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| Subject: |
Prediction about SCOTUS ruling today
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Date:
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6/28/2012 8:59:39 AM
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I'm afraid you may be right. Unfortunately the individual mandate, while garnering the most attention, is only a small part of the travesty that was foisted on the American people.
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| Name: |
GoneFishin
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| Subject: |
Prediction about SCOTUS ruling today
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Date:
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6/28/2012 9:55:16 AM
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It's a travesty to those who have health coverage. If the mandate goes down, it will be interesting to see the GOP solution. They promised a solution after Hillarycare went down and over the past 20 years have done nothing.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Looks like it survived 6-3
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Date:
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6/28/2012 10:17:23 AM (updated 6/28/2012 10:19:12 AM)
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They said that the mandate was a tax and could stand. Roberts and Kennedy joined the left leaning part of the court. No surprise with Kennedy but Roberts does a little. Actually now that I say that Rush Limbaugh predicted he would join the left on this decision but would not say why.
We'll see how this all plays out in November but I suspect this will once again energize conservatives the way a defeat of Obamacare would have energized the left.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
And stocks are tumbling as a result
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Date:
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6/28/2012 10:55:58 AM
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No surprise that the ruling is bad for most businesses and the economy.
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| Name: |
GoneFishin
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| Subject: |
Roberts 5-4
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Date:
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6/28/2012 11:00:37 AM
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Roberts looked at Romneycare and said its a tax like what Romney signed in Mass. when he was governor.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Roberts 5-4
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Date:
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6/28/2012 11:24:00 AM
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Well that's what the administration argued and did so successfully. I think it was 6-3 but maybe Kennedy didn't bite on the tax argument. Of course it being a tax gives the lie to what Obama said when he tried to sell the plan. Essentially SCOTUS said this is a political decision and needs to be solved politically.
For those fiscally conservative Independents that don't like Romney I would hope this will be a clarion call for them to step away from the cliff and get actively involved in helping him defeat Oblamer.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Roberts 5-4
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Date:
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6/28/2012 11:33:36 AM (updated 6/28/2012 11:35:11 AM)
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Just read that Kennedy did indeed vote with the minority. Interesting that Roberts saved Obamacare but I can't fault his logic. If indeed the mandate is a tax then the federal government has the ability to do so which creates more of a political problem for the Messiah.
One interesting aspect of the ruling is that the court did say that the mandate could not survive under the commerce clause.
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| Name: |
GoneFishin
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| Subject: |
Roberts 5-4
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Date:
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6/28/2012 1:05:08 PM
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The court also ruled that Washington can't force the states to expand Medicaid. This may well result in more being covered under the mandate provision.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Roberts 5-4
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Date:
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6/28/2012 1:18:29 PM
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Which means more poor will see their taxes increase, right? So much for Oblamer's promise that no one earning under $250K will see a single dime of new taxes. The more I think about this Roberts may have handed the Messiah a huge political problem. Now the American people know that Obamacare was always a tax despite the lies told by Dems in Congress and TOTUS.
As for me, if this actually goes into effect I will likely go the cheaper route and send my employees to the state exchanges and they will realize what people in other countries already realize. It will be more expensive and care will be rationed. There is no example where this isn't true. Just came from a trip to the UK and it was all over the news that about 30,000 people every year die unnecessarily because of rationed health care.
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| Name: |
GoneFishin
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| Subject: |
Roberts 5-4
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Date:
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6/28/2012 1:28:04 PM
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How many die in the US for lack of any insurance? There are 2 sides to the coin. Romney's wife would not be able to secure coverage with her medical history under current individual plans.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Excellent point......
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Date:
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6/28/2012 1:49:56 PM
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Now thats a great point that you made so lets carry that line of thinking to its natural conclusion. According to the Harvard study they have projected 45,000 people die each year from lack of insurance which represents 0.01% (other studies have it much lower). In the UK, 30,000 people die each year due to rationing which represents 0.05% of the population. So using your logic it is better to have 151,000 people in the U.S. die due to rationing versus the current 45,000 (and probably less) due to lack of insurance. Great idea GF........
Thanks for proving my point that Obamacare is a disaster for the country. Vote for Romney in 2012 if you really care about our health and welfare. But we all know that isn't the point.....power and control are all that matters to the left.
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| Name: |
Lifer
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| Subject: |
Individual plans, yes.....
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Date:
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6/28/2012 2:51:59 PM
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But as you know and I have pointed out before, this is NOT TRUE for group plans. Any condition once covered under any group plan MUST be covered under any future group plan. That is one of the provisions of COBRA. I didn't look up the difference in enrollment of individual vs. group plans for this post post, but if memory serves 90+% of folks in the US fall under group coverage as opposed to individual. This remains true even if there is a gap in coverage of several years. I know this to be true because I have made use of this provision personally.
Also what most folks don't know is that even individuals can get group coverage in different ways. One way that I know of is to join the Chamber of Commerce in many small and medium size towns. Many offer programs that allow you as a member to qualify for group coverage as a benefit of membership. Most CoC's can be joined for very little cost as an individual, usually around $100/yr.
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| Name: |
GoneFishin
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| Subject: |
Individual plans, yes.....
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Date:
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6/28/2012 3:28:26 PM
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"Vote for Romney in 2012 if you really care about our health and welfare." Now, what do you think Romney is going to do? You seem to be against too many people having covered. I guess as long as you and your family is covered why worry about others.
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| Name: |
Barneget
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| Subject: |
Individual plans, yes.....
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Date:
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6/28/2012 4:32:38 PM
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GF, you seem to have bought in to this whole disaster being about the uninsured. When the commies first advanced their 2009 proposals, the number of uninsured was 12 million. Then, when they couldn't make the math work, it grew overnight to 30 million. Then, with the cost still well beyond anything a thinking American would tolerate, it was about preexisting conditions. Then, it was about access. Then, it was about emphasis. All of this is krapp. This is all about central power and redistribution of wealth. Between 1997 and 2008, fewer than 1% of health insurance applicants were denied coverage due to pre existing conditions. Recent surveys show that 65% of the uninsured are without coverage by choice, meaning that they see cable and cell phones as more important. The ACA mandates coverage for all, unless a FoO waiver is secured, with those coverages for all controlled by the appointed, entrenched beuracrats executing an unnaccountable agenda. This law provides many many of us with far less private insurance coverage, with greatly reduced options, for far more money. Yeah, I got mine alright. Glad you can see that.
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| Name: |
GoneFishin
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| Subject: |
Individual plans, yes.....
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Date:
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6/28/2012 4:49:43 PM
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Leave it to Hob Knob to solve it.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Individual plans, yes.....
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Date:
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6/28/2012 7:26:36 PM
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And you seem to prefer having more people die from rationing rather than common sense reform that focuses on getting those without coverage and actually wanting coverage to get insurance. But then again you have your insurance and don't have to worry about rationing.......for now......until your employer puts you in the state exchanges because it is cheaper.....
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
And stocks are tumbling as a result
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Date:
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6/28/2012 9:25:34 PM
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Looks like you spoke too soon twice in the same thread MM!
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| Name: |
water_watcher
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| Subject: |
are you serious???
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Date:
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6/29/2012 6:19:54 AM (updated 6/29/2012 6:20:48 AM)
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It is europe that contibuted to the last hour recovery ... same reason futures are up this morning. But you should talk ... not one of what you said was going to happen with the economy under oblamer has come true ... so what is your excuse for supporting such a failer? More excuses??
How do you feel about the conservative justice saving oblamers agenda that the american people still do not want and made Oblamer a liar by turning it in to a tax ... just as we said it was.
While Oblamer is doing a victory lap ... this could be the last nail in his cofin. Especially when Roberts reminds everyone that if you don't like it, change it by changing who you vote in office.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
are YOU serious???
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Date:
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6/29/2012 7:52:49 AM (updated 6/29/2012 8:04:23 AM)
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WW Please get control. I simply pointed out a fact...MM spoke too soon twice in the same thread. Further, I often do not agree with Chief Justice Roberts but he is a true scholar and has my respect (can't say the same for "Uncle Tom" Thomas or "Godfather" Nino) and I seriously doubt we will be hearing any comments from the Chief Justice suggesting how we vote. NOW, get off your typical petty nut case high horse and SHOVE IT!
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| Name: |
Lifer
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| Subject: |
are YOU serious???
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Date:
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6/29/2012 8:33:42 AM
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"I seriously doubt we will be hearing any comments from the Chief Justice suggesting how we vote."
That should read any more comments. Im sure you have seen the paragraph already but chose to ignore it.
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| Name: |
water_watcher
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| Subject: |
what a racist you are
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Date:
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6/29/2012 8:52:37 AM
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Here is some news you do not report ... why is it that when you and jellyfish see a morsel of positive news you jump all over it ... but the facts are this president has been a complete failure. Take any measure. Negative employment growth, doubling the national debt, higher poverty level, more minority unemployment, debt down grade, on and on and on.
Here is a news flash ... more pain and suffering for america under Oblamer.
Consumer Spending Weakest in Five Months
CNBC Breaking News breakingnews@cnbc.com via cnbc.sparklist.com 8:33 AM (13 minutes ago)
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
And stocks are tumbling as a result
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Date:
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6/29/2012 9:11:56 AM
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Thanks for driving by Archie. That headline was from pmsnBS and reflected the original reaction when the news about it being upheld wasn't understood. Once the markets saw that Roberts had out of whoile cloth recast the mandate as a tax they recognized the political implications and the burden this would for Oblamer and any Dem that voted for it in November.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Archie the out of the closet racist and bigot
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Date:
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6/29/2012 9:16:54 AM
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Archie, I know from your upbringing that you spent all your time with rednecks and racists and apparently you still are one. Calling Clarence Thomas an Uncle Tom is just as bad as using the n word and like Hound, we now know how you feel about black people. And your disparaging comments about Scalia's heritage is likewise bigoted. Its what I always knew about a left wing nut libtard like you that you not only ascribe to the soft bigotry of low expectations but the blatant bigotry and racism toward others that are not the same color as you or are WASPs. Shame, shame Archie. From now on you shall be called the Forum Bigot.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
Archie the out of the closet racist and bigot
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Date:
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6/29/2012 10:40:50 AM
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To be called a "bigot", "racist", "libtard" etc adinfunitum by MM is a wonderful promotion from his previous assements including "baby killer", "America hater", and "s**t head". I wear any negative name calling from the likes of the neo nuts on this forum as a badge of honor.
I will stop calling Thomas an Uncle Tom when he stops being an uncle Tom and Scalia the Godfather when he stops acting and speaking before right wing groups and socializing with rightwing officials yet refuses to recuse himself from deliberations involving the same people and groups he has interacted with. He is no more than a mafia thug.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Just keep posting your bigoted rants
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Date:
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6/29/2012 3:07:51 PM
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You and Hound make good company in the now out of closet racist ranks. I am sure some of the brothers in downtown Atlanta would love for you to call them that but then you are such a gutless wonder that you do so totally anonymously. You are who you are Forum Bigot and that is forever your new name.
Keep driving by Forum Bigot........or return to the jokes section where you really belong......
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
MM you are such a sweet kitty cat...meow
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Date:
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6/30/2012 11:21:39 PM
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
Dream on!
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Date:
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7/1/2012 9:20:18 AM
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
I just saw this response
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Date:
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7/6/2012 11:38:06 AM
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Is it just me or is this response kind of creepy? It made the hair on the back of my neck stand up. There is nothing worse than a creepy out of the closet forum bigot......... I feel the need to shower...........ugh........shiver......
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| Name: |
MrHodja
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| Subject: |
I just saw this response
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Date:
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7/6/2012 11:51:56 AM
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Maybe Archie has a man-crush on you like GF has on WW.....LMAO!
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Oh my!
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Date:
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7/6/2012 1:18:45 PM
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I sure hope not. I'm not that kind of guy. LOL
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