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Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Ben Shapiro owns Piers Morgan
Date:	1/11/2013 10:22:48 PM

This is an entertaining piece if you have the time. I love the Brits but this Piers Morgan is a pompous a$$ to say the least. I suspect he thought he had another Alex Jones and I can assure you was not prepared for the slamming he got....talk about facts, logic and reason smoting emotion and illogic. Buon appetit! http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2013/01/11/friday-fun-ben-shapiro-destroys-cnns-piers-morgan-n1487128

Name:	MrHodja -	Reply
Subject:	Ben Shapiro owns Piers Morgan
Date:	1/11/2013 10:44:30 PM (updated 1/11/2013 10:49:24 PM)

Wow. Shapiro is dead-on.

Copper, I suggest you watch, because that is exactly where I am coming from. Before Obama the only gun I ever bought was a 1957 JC Higgins single shot 22. Because of the direction I see this country headed I now have a lot more than that, both for self defense but not hunting (my wife won't let me kill Bambi), and the possibility that at some point in the future there may be a need, as envisioned by our forefathers when they penned and approved the second amendment to our constitution.

Name:	copperline -	Reply
Subject:	Ben Shapiro owns Piers Morgan
Date:	1/12/2013 12:13:09 AM

Haven't seen this interview, but really guys? This is beginning to sound like the same position taken by radicals in the 60's. I can remember thinking that either Nixon's Palace Guard or George Wallace's State Police were on the verge of kicking our doors in, too. Finally it dawned on me that if it ever gets to that point, it's game over anyway.

Name:	MrHodja -	Reply
Subject:	Ben Shapiro owns Piers Morgan
Date:	1/12/2013 9:29:47 AM

There are a couple factors that mitigate against it ever getting there. First is an armed populace. There are still enough who feel so strongly that they would resist force with force, and that in itself is a deterrent to a tyrannical takeover under the guise that it is OK with the populace to do so. The second is the US military. The military strongly supports its forces to become better educated, an in so doing develops folks who are capable of thinking for themselves while following LAWFUL orders. I don't see the US military as mindless robots, and if a tyrannical (UNLAWFUL) takeover were to be attempted our concept of civilian control of the military might be tested like never before,

The next four years will certainly be interesting, to say the least.

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Ben Shapiro owns Piers Morgan
Date:	1/12/2013 10:36:37 AM

Don't take it that way because that is exactly the perspective that people like Piers Morgan want us to have. Did you notice that he often moved the conversation away from the very persuasive points being made by Mr. Shapiro and in the end tried to focus all the discussion on and tried to misrepresent and marginalize him? It is a common ploy and we should not all for it. If you don't agree that a tyrannical government is a legitimate concern that's OK. But that disagreement should not impact your ability to consider and potentially agree with his other points. That is actually the thesis of his book and he is right about the tactics used by the left with arguments that they can't win on the merits. Don't fall for that and don't let people like Piers Morgan succeed. But if you read what the founding fathers wrote it is clear that they feared a tyrannical government. And as Mr. Shapiro rightly points out history is replete with totalitarian govts that started as a democratically elected one. Hitler was elected. Mousillini was elected. Chavez was elected. Achmidinijad was elected. You can see we have lots of recent history that fits that mold. While I completely agree that the chances of this in the US are incredibly remote and one reason is an armed populace. But as George Santayana put it so well, "Those that don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it". I don't lay awake at night worrying about this but I respect the possibility enough that I see the 2nd Amendment as essential to ensuring that it never happens here. The more you read history (which I do voraciously) the more you realize there is nothinewes new under the sun and the more you respect the wisdom of those that realize that technology may change and progress may be made, but fundamental human nature remains. We just repeat our mistakes, societies go in cycles, countries rise to dominance and then fade.....but to think that somehow we are immune to it is our greatest danger.

Name:	Summer Lover -	Reply
Subject:	Times change..
Date:	1/12/2013 10:43:23 AM

When I was in JROTC, the Soviets were getting their a$$es handed to them by a bunch of cavemen in Afghanistan with homemade AK's (and Stingers from the CIA), and their military taught top command only - the leaders knew the mission details, the grunts only followed, so the tactics were to cut off the head. I still feel that the US military would go AWOL before engaging the U.S. citizens, the UN would not - we are the aggressors you know. I agree that it will be a tough battle here, we have already fought for our freedom, and many of us will do so now.

Name:	copperline -	Reply
Subject:	Times change..
Date:	1/12/2013 10:58:38 AM

I would think that an informed populace would be more likely to prevent tyranny than an armed one. And the notion that massive infusions of unrestricted guns into society is somehow protective to our form of government seems to be be highly speculative at best. The rise in gun violence and related deaths isn't speculative. It's tangible.

Yes, I doubt the US military would ever turn its guns on its citizens too. And I REALLY doubt that keeping it that way can be accomplished by getting into an arms race with them......

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Times change..
Date:	1/12/2013 11:08:09 AM (updated 1/12/2013 11:11:36 AM)

Germany had a highly intelligent, educated and informed populace and they gave us Hitler. Italy likewise. Your faith in being informed is much greater than mine. And if you critically look at the state of our education system today, the blatant bias of the mainstream media, etc. you might not have as much confidence in an informed populace as you do. But besides all that, I believe it is a very well informed populace that understands the value and validity of the 2nd Amendment and why opposition to eroding it is in fact exactly what we need right now, particularly with an out of control federal government and a WH that has more flexibility now that he is freed from reelection. Despite that I agree it is remote and I agree that an armed populace isn't in and of itself the only deterrent but it can play a key role and should not be discarded out of some misguided belief that banning certain types of weapons will have any impact on gun related violence when in fact we know the opposite is true. That's what I can't understand......why are we even talking about this side issue and not the real issues with our culture?

Name:	copperline -	Reply
Subject:	Times change..
Date:	1/12/2013 11:43:05 AM

But I can't agree that classifying and banning certain types of weapons won't have a positive impact on gun violence. I also think it's possible to distinguish between consumer-use guns and military-style armaments, and put rational limits on the latter without compromising the Republic.

In the past, you've made the point that Liberals tend to want to discuss abstractions and theory, while being hesitant to take concrete steps to address a problem.    I'll be happy to discuss the cultural issues, but I keep thinking we need to do something about this & stop chasing our theoretical tails.

So, what can we do about gun violence if we don't address gun control?   The other ideas I am hearing have to do with arming teachers, increasing concealed carry permits, increased spending on security in every school from kindergarten to college, enhanced back ground checks, legislating a curb on violent video games and a national registry of mental illness.   Is that all we can come up with?

I hope not.

Name:	comrade -	Reply
Subject:	Times change..
Date:	1/12/2013 11:48:09 AM

What would you add to the list?

Name:	copperline -	Reply
Subject:	Times change..
Date:	1/12/2013 1:53:10 PM

I'm throwing out ideas I've heard but don't necessarily think will work. Arming teachers seems like a ridiculous thing to do. The people I know who want to be teachers are not the kind of folks who would like to carry a gun to work. Increased conceal carrying of weapons is something I am opposed to because I don't think more people with more guns are the answer. Increased school security is hard to argue with, except to say I don't think people will agree with the increased educational spending required to do this adequately. I think armed school staff & enhanced security could also change the educational environment in a school... and not for the better. Enhanced background checks are OK, making laws against violent video games is going to be very difficult to enforce, and a national registry of mental health would raise a firestorm of additional civil liberty issues. So only the background checks is an idea, other than restrictions on military weapons, that I could go with right now.

I just got back from the computer shop and had a short discussion with the tech about computing and video games. An avid gamer, he thinks that there is no relationship between video game violence and real violence, that laws attempting to curtain the content of video games would violate the 1st Amendment free speech provisions, and that aggressive video games give his 12 yr old son a way to ventilate any anger he might feel in a healthy way so that afterward he is more calm and less likely to be aggressive.

You?

Name:	comrade -	Reply
Subject:	Times change..
Date:	1/12/2013 2:33:20 PM

Yep. Background checks is the only thing reasonable. :-)

Name:	buzzbuster -	Reply
Subject:	Times change..
Date:	1/12/2013 11:11:42 PM

I would feel much better knowing that there were armed personal (Teachers,Faculty,Custodians,Principles and any Adult)trained with weapons in the school system to stop the crazies from commenting these terrible acts. Better security upon entering a school and plans (Drills) in the event something was about to or was happening, to keep the students and teachers safe. Many people can handle fire arms such as x-military, x-police officers, etc. The door He went through at Sandy Hook was only glass, A steel door would have at the very least slowed him down which may have given others time to stop him from such a awful result. Cameras at the doors was a very good idea and a way to keep them out from entering. Windows and the like is also something to look at. There many things to help if you just do some brain storming. I along with many other Americans do not want My/Our 2nd amendment rights trampled on because some are not looking at other possible alternatives. Leave My fire arm rights alone!

Name:	Old Diver -	Reply
Subject:	Can it Happen Here?
Date:	1/13/2013 3:31:40 AM

As terrible as these shootings are, we really need to focus on the real mass killers and that is Socialist/Communist governments. These governments have killed over four times the number of their own people as died in all the wars of the 20th century! With the collusion of the media this is almost unknown. Look up democide. It is shocking!
Knowing how untrustworthy governments can be our wise founding fathers equipped Americans to resist such murderous tyranny. That is the real reason for the 2nd.
Our government is now embarked on a disturbing path. Why all these strange Presidential Directives? Why all this hollow point ammo purchase? Why the creation of "Homeland Security? On and on. Remember, the only thing the old communist did very, very well was the overthrow of governments. It can happen here!

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