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| Name: |
Buteye
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| Subject: |
Job Creation
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Date:
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1/19/2013 12:11:25 AM
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The unemployment rate when President Obama took office four years ago was 7.8%. The unemployment rate today is still 7.8%. I seem to remember the Presdent saying the unemployment rate would be 6.2% by the end of his first term. Just saw on TV that the President's Job Council only met one time during the last year. Does that sound like the President has any interest in creating new jobs? Is there a possibility that the President does not want to create new jobs? Is it not logical that the lack of creation of new jobs leaves more people to apply for unemployment benefits and other entitlements which are available? As we know, as more people receive entitlements, the support for the Obama administration just continues grow. I just read an interesting observation suggesting that if entitlements were not so prevalent, people might spend more time searching for jobs and have less time to become drawn into criminal activities.
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| Name: |
comrade
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| Subject: |
Job Creation
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Date:
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1/19/2013 8:19:20 AM
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How old are you? Do you actually believe that people are able to take care of themselves? I was raised to believe that, but time and particularly my president have shown that that is an incredible presumption. Whether or not the jobs are better is not important any more. We need to be happy that all things are provided for us, our children are safe and have no worries, and that our leader is well pleased. There is no way to question the leader's intentions without embarrassing, and most likely offending the only one who is trying to help us all - please don't get us all in trouble.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
It's much worse than that
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Date:
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1/19/2013 9:01:51 AM
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The real unemployment rate has gone from 7.8% when he took office up to probably closer to 10% today. They always spout the U2 number which does not count those that have given up ever finding a job. Since TOTUS took office millions more have joined those ranks making it look like he has done significantly better than he has. And that also doesn't count those that are underemployed which is around 17% and significantly higher than when he took office. Recall the sniping at Bush over jobs at McDonalds? Well under our affirmative action president those are suddenly jobs to congratulate him for.
And now Archie will provide us with the fictional jobs created numbers which I do not believe and even if true are not much comfort to the 9% unemployed and 17% underemployed.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
Job Creation...in perspective
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Date:
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1/19/2013 9:45:22 AM (updated 1/19/2013 9:47:51 AM)
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A more accurate way to observe and forecast economic trends is not to look at one aspect of what is happening at point A and then again at point B and assume if the two look the same there is no change. Better analysis....When Obama took office for his 1st term the unemployment rate was 7.8%, monthly job losses were 750,000+, and early in his first term the unemployment rate reached 9.7% then began to fall. When he began his 2d term the unemployment rate was 7.8% and falling and the monthly job gains were 150,000+. I know you guys don't like it, but that is the way it is.
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| Name: |
h_hob
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| Subject: |
Job Creation...in perspective
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Date:
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1/19/2013 10:12:22 AM
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Archiebelle,
I hope you have a swift recovery from the terrible affliction I just heard you have and now I understand more about your postings. My best wishes to you and I'll remember you in my prayers.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
Job Creation...in perspective
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Date:
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1/19/2013 1:29:12 PM
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And what affliction is that...an open mind?
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
You are doing exactly
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Date:
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1/19/2013 2:29:24 PM
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what you are lecturing us not to do. Looking at just one criteria....you amaze me sometimes Archie in your total invincible ignorance and inability to see your own contradictions. Here's my list of reasons why I think TOTUS is an abysmal failure and they don't rely on any one thing but taken in sum total it is inescapibly true to all but the most invincibly ignorant.
Real unemployment over 9% for four years
Real underemployment over 15% for four years
Pathetic GDP growth
Massive record deficits - the worst since WW2
Record numbers of people on food stamps
Record numbers of people on SS disability
Unemployment benefit extensions as far as the eye can see.
I could go on and on and on but I will stop here.
Facts.........stubborn things. Now if you want to try to blame Bush or the GOP House or something like that we can have a debate......but on his record.....I think not.
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| Name: |
h_hob
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| Subject: |
Job Creation...in perspective
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Date:
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1/19/2013 4:15:44 PM
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Archiebelle,
Your quote, "And what affliction is that...an open mind?"
Nope, oppositional defiance disorder.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
And you are doing exactly as always
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Date:
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1/19/2013 6:39:57 PM
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Facts are stubborn things MM. I try to consider them all while you only recognize those that comply with your preconceived determination of what you want to be. Do you even recognize the fact that between Jan 2009 and Jan 2013 there has been 930,000+ turn around in the monthly new job statistics...the biggest turn around in actual numbers in a similar period ever? I agree things are not good, not nearly as good as I hope we all would like. Is it even in your mental ability to agree that things at least are better than they were? He//, say it is in spite of Obama if you want, but at least wake up and see reality for once in your skewed and blinder obscured view of the world.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
You mean being right? I agree!
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Date:
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1/19/2013 9:33:35 PM
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| Name: |
Lifer
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| Subject: |
Tell the 200+ folks in Alex City things are better
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Date:
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1/20/2013 10:55:37 AM (updated 1/20/2013 11:07:11 AM)
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That's the 200+ Russell production workers that were given lay off notices last week. Or maybe the 'white collar' jobs that were done away with this week with the elimination of an entire department. But it's OK, a few of the top guys were offered 'positions' in Montgomery with accompanying pay that wouldn't by fuel for the commute at today's Obama gas prices.
It's OK though, after all Obama, or as NewsWeek proclaimed this week, THE SECOND COMING has created one industry boom. That's the gun and ammo industry. He will go down in history as the best gun salesman of all time.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
Economic prosperity
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Date:
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1/20/2013 1:27:49 PM (updated 1/20/2013 1:31:40 PM)
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or depression is always spread unequally. Sorry for the 200 folks in Alex City. Can you be gracious enough to congratulate the 1400 people being hired by Caterpillar in Athens, GA, the 1500 being hired by a pharmaceutical Co. in Covington, GA, the 1000 being hired by GM in the Atlanta area, the 400 new Delta folks and the net 5,000,000 new wage earners over the last 3 years? To some, me included, the glass is no better than half full and filling much too slowly, to all the T-party crowd around L Martin the glass will be not only empty but shattered as long as Barack Obama is in the White House...regardless of what the economy does.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
There you go again
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Date:
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1/20/2013 4:47:35 PM (updated 1/20/2013 4:50:50 PM)
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6 million jobs lost, 5 million people hired and you declare victory. Simply amazing when you consider the fact that the economy needs to add around 175,000 or more jobs each month just to account for new prospective employees entering the workforce. By the way GF, that means need around 8,000,000 new jobs in four years just to keep unemployment from going up. Of course you could always use the TOTUS approach, officially endorsed by hypocritical left wing nuts like you, drive millions out of the workforce so they aren't even counted.
And by the way, I would be willing to bet most, if not all, of those new jobs you are touting came at the expense of workers in other states that are less business friendly.
The glass half full......LMAO with that one. Join us in the real world Archie, it will change your life. Or stay in your deluded bubble while the rest of us deal with reality. Do you have some masochistic need to be humiliated over and over again?
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| Name: |
comrade
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| Subject: |
Economic prosperity
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Date:
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1/20/2013 5:02:50 PM
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Just for the backdrop - you are in the Atlanta area, but how are you acquainted with Lake Martin?
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Almost nothing
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Date:
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1/20/2013 5:19:26 PM
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But he has all sorts of prejudiced ideas about them.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
There you go again...blah,blah,blah
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Date:
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1/20/2013 5:21:50 PM (updated 1/20/2013 5:31:31 PM)
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The economy is now up net 600,000 since the downturn began in early 2008, (I know you hate it MM but it is reality) and the good news would would be even better except for the other GOOD news...public sector jobs are down over 2,000,000. The Athens, Covington, Atlanta and most of the Delta expansions are new jobs, not replacements for other jobs cut elsewhere. Caterpillar in fact decided to expand in the USA rather than the original plan to build in Asia. MM why don't you take your oft repeated advice to me...Look at the facts before putting your foot in your mouth.
BTW: Please show me where I declared the Carter administration was an economic success story. In an earlier post I did point out without comment that the job gain was 10.3 million during the Carter years. Do you dispute that? Do you have any idea why the increase was so impressive in those 4 years?*
MM, you really need to read more carefully and look at the total stats more closely before you pop off.
*Hint...the reason for much of the increase in jobs in the late 70's is directly related to one of the reasons a larger number than usual are dropping out of the job market today. Explain it to us Mr MBA.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
There you go again...stupid, stupid, stupid
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Date:
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1/20/2013 5:43:37 PM
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Archie, my numbers are irrefutable. You are happy that we are up a few jobs when we need to be up so many more just to keep up with population growth. You are like a rabid dog that has a grip on a fake bone.....you are too addled to let go. My our job creation numbers are a friggin disaster and you are too dense to figure it out. You are truly the poster child for invincible ignorance....invincible because you actually think you are clever.
Get over it Archie, TOTUS has been an abysmal failure and all the economic data prove it. Even most leftists are smart enough to recognize it and try to blame it on how bad a situation Oblamer inherited......but not you, you hold onto to your fake bone. Come back to reality blah blah. Yep, that's your new name blah blah.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
Lake Martin?
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Date:
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1/20/2013 11:47:33 PM
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I stumbled on the lakes online site a few years ago during the extreme drought trying to find a good site to keep up with lake levels. Imagine my wonder when I found the Off Topics forum which is 80% controlled by very very conservative Lake Martin people. This site includes hundreds of lakes but is completely dominated by the lovers of just one lake.
Back to you MM, who is the stupid one? I have stated my disappointment with Obama but point out correctly that when he took office we were losing 750,000+ jobs every month and now we are gaining 150,000+. When he took office the unemployment rate was going up and it is now going down. When he took office home prices were falling at the fastest rate since the 1930's and now they are going up. When he took office the GDP was dropping at a rate of 8% per year while it is now going up at 3% per year. I am no where near satisfied at what the economy is doing but am very glad at least it no longer in free-fall. I don't expect you to ever support Obama or his policies but I would hope you are honest enough to accept and recognize reality as a fact rather than continually ignore or deny it and be gracious enough to acknowledge it rather than condemn the messenger who points it out. If McCain had been elected and the stats of the economic recovery (not economic policy but the results) were exactly in line with what they are under Obama would you still be as quick to condemn? Please be honest.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Finally a partial admission of TOTUS' failure
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Date:
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1/21/2013 8:34:14 AM (updated 1/21/2013 8:37:39 AM)
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Thanks for asking and I will answer your question, you are the stupid one and here is why. Archie, can you for once take off you blinders and recognize that creating 150,000 new jobs four years into a recovery is absolutely pathetic and cannot even keep up with population growth? Of course there were job losses during the recession that was created by the housing bubble and that with a recovery those losses should stop. But think about it man, use your friggin God given brain!!! If you need over 175,000 jobs per month just to keep up with population growth and you are only creating 150,000 jobs per month how in world can unemployment go down?!?!?!? Is there some magical wand, some magic formula that TOTUS came up with?!?!? Of course not and the chart below is your answer. The labor participation rate has dropped like a rock as his policies have been implemented. And just to assuage your immediate reaction to question the source this came from BLS but please, feel free to look it up yourself. If we had the same labor participation rate in 2012 U2 and U6 would both be showing an upward trend. But when your policies are so destructive people simply give up ever finding a job and thus are not counted amongst the unemployed. Magic! Now I don't blame you Archie because I know where your knowledge base comes from and it is a shame we don't have a GOP president because I assure you the LPR would be all over the news every day explaining what a sham recovery we are in. Well except if we had a president that didn't hate real achievement (because he is the affirmative action president who has been given everything because of the box he checks under race), the free markets and this country we would have a real recovery and we would be creating 500,000 jobs per month, not the paltry 150K that you seem so proud of. Your definition of success makes George W. Bush look like a raging economic genius....but then again, he is held to a different standard than the affirmative action president isn't he?
Archie, explain why this recovery has been the worst ever (well except under FDR)? Of course the economy is gradually improving in some areas and stagnant in others like unemployment (or at least recognized by those of us with a brain). This has been a pathetic recovery because of the damaging economic policies of TOTUS, the irresponsible and illegal failure on the part of Dems to pass a budget and remove so much uncertainty simply for the personal political gain (aided and abetted by the government media of course), the passage of laws like Obamacare that have caused insurance premiums to skyrocket and will now begin to harm the economy with new taxes, the constant threat of tax increases for those very same job creators that you seem to stupidly think are creating enough jobs.
You need to stop asking me to think Archie, because I give you a lesson every time you post. Its just you are too ideologically blind to believe the truth about anything.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Some more ammo on the farce of your numbers
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Date:
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1/21/2013 12:03:25 PM
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"The number of Americans age 16 or older who decided not to work or even to seek a job increased by 8,332,000 to a record 88,839,000 in President Barack Obama’s first term, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics. … The increase in Americans opting out of the labor force during Obama’s first term resulted in a decrease in the labor force participation rate from 65.7 percent in January 2009, the month Obama was first inaugurated, to 63.6 percent in December 2012, the latest month reported. Before Obama took office, the labor force participation rate had not been as low as 63.6 percent since 1981, the year President Ronald Reagan took over from President Jimmy Carter. … When Obama was inaugurated in January 2009, there were 80,507,000 American civilians age 16 or older who did not have a job or seek one. In December 2012, there were 88,839,000—thus, the increase of 8,332,000. …"
Now lets do the math Archibald because I know at times GF is math challenged. Those who have abandoned the labor market as a result of your much beloved messiah's feckless policies equals about 174,000 each month since he was originally crowned. Add that 174,000 leaving the workforce each month to the 175,000 new jobs needed to cover population growth and that equals......I'll give you a minute to do this yourself......yes, you got it, 349,000 jobs per month just to keep unemployment from going up!! Congratulations!
I will leave the rest of the math to you but as you can see, your crowing about the addition of a paltry 150,000 for part of TOTUS's first term is once again like the CEO focusing on the jobs created in one division while another is bleeding more jobs. He is a pathetic, miserable failure and only you and a few other looney toons at pmsnBS, daily kos and huffnpuff think otherwise. You are not exactly in the most intelligent company there blah, blah.
Speaking of which, will you put blah, blah, blah in your subject line? I do so enjoy seeing it.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
Man are you PO'd
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Date:
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1/21/2013 7:05:39 PM
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I guess you are in total melt down as Obama starts his 2d term.
Just a few comments...Jimmy Carter's term coincided with the post WWII baby boomers joining the consumer an job market at the same time which led to very high job growth. Now guess what? The Obama years coincides with those same people starting to retire (that means they quit looking for a job MM) which accounts for at least some of the decline in the number of people in the job market. If someone retires or if someone starts school or if a mother decides to stay at home to home school her kids (I'm sure you support this MM) that is not "becoming discouraged.
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| Name: |
MrHodja
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| Subject: |
Man are you PO'd
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Date:
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1/21/2013 7:41:01 PM
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mas·och·ism Noun - The tendency to derive pleasure, esp. sexual gratification, from one's own pain or humiliation.
- (in general use) The enjoyment of what appears to be painful or tiresome.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Not angry.....just sad......
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Date:
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1/21/2013 7:49:51 PM
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As for your weak attempt at an explanation it is so pathetically sad I can barely control myself from guffawing. I want to laugh and cry all at the same time but lets take your explanation to its logical conclusion. So we have a small reduction in the labor participation rate until about Jan 2009 and suddenly it drops like a rock for the next three years. Now assuming all these retirees are 65 that means from 1934 to 1937 there was a sudden and unexplained baby boom......except that is not what the population data shows. I know, a whole bunch of people took early retirement, right? They just magically decided to do it during the last three years of Obama's term. That the LBR includes all eligible workers from age 16-64 is immaterial. Heck, those 18 year olds are takin early retirement.
Yes Archibald, some people retire every year and some people enter the labor force for the first time. And no doubt a small portion of the dramatic drop is a result of that. But this drop would occur as a long term trend and not a precipitous one. Archie, use your brain and think about what you are posting before you do so. Tis better to be thought a fool that to type out a post and remove all doubt. So no Blah, Blah, retirees do not explain the the calamitous drop in our labor participation rate from 2009 to today. It was caused by people giving up all hope of ever finding a job because of the feckless policies of your messiah.
But it was a nice try......pathetic and weak but at least you tried. Just admit it, your jobs numbers are likewise pathetic and weak and reflect a failed president that was given a gimme by the American people because their expectations were so low......just like all affirmative action beneficiaries.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
LOL
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Date:
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1/21/2013 7:54:31 PM (updated 1/21/2013 8:03:14 PM)
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Describes him perfectly. It did not occur to me that anyone could actually enjoy constant humiliation but he really does seem to. Just look at his insistence that job creation during Oblamer's first term is actually something to be proud of. And his phony numbers about job creation. If you look at the BLS data from January 2009 to December 2012 we lost almost 400,000 jobs while Archibald spouts millions created. Just hilarious and he has an almost pathological desire to be eviscerated. Kind of weird and pathetic.....even GF has given up engaging in the arena of ideas and just makes silly comments. Archie can't seem to be beaten often enough or hard enough.....there must be a clinical explanation for it but I am no expert in these kind of maladies.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
Talk about FARCE
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Date:
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1/22/2013 12:44:24 AM
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MM what did you pull these numbers out of???
According to BLS the total participating job force in Dec 2012 was 155,511,000 (as an aside 1,100,000 higher than in Dec 2008). If you add your 89,000,000 figure of people over 16 who want to work but don't have jobs to this you get 254,500,000 people. The census bureau says the population of the US is currently estimated at 315,000,000 and that under 18 year olds and over 65 year olds make up 34% of that total or about 106,000,000. I will charitably offer that perhaps some of these are between the "over 16 year old" figure you use and the "under 18" used by census and that many those over 65 still want to work...so lets cut that figure by 33% to 70,000,000 (for certain it is higher than that but as I say...charitable). Now let's do some MBA arithmetic:
Your figure...............89,000,000
BLS figure .............155,511,000
2/3 Census figure.... 70,000,000
__________________________
TOTAL 324,511,000 or almost 10,000,000 more people than the population of the US according to the census bureau. Wonder where all the people who simply don't want to work (early retirees, stay at home moms, high school and college students over 16, the very elderly (centenarians?) who don't work and have no desire to work, those shiftless "taker" in the 47%)...gosh, add those in and we are talking 60, maybe 80 million that you picked up but the census somehow missed. Gee MM can you help us understand this???
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
You are an expert in farce
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Date:
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1/22/2013 8:20:10 AM (updated 1/22/2013 9:27:15 AM)
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Archie, I am having trouble following your numbers, most of which look made up to me. Maybe GF can translate for me as he seems to think more like you do.
But dude, if you look at the labor participation rate and the way it has dropped like a rock in the last three years of Oblamer's first term......or Jimmy Carter's second term as I like to call it.....and that chart came directly from BLS...it stands to reason that there are more people out of the workforce and no longer being counted in U2 and U6, right? I mean at least we can agree on that, right? Or have you figured out a way for that not to happen? I don't need to try to sort out your tortured attempts at math to understand what has happened,
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
My numbers are correct
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Date:
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1/22/2013 1:27:16 PM (updated 1/22/2013 1:51:08 PM)
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and backed up by source. My point MM was that your numbers were out of context (numbers as well as words can be used out of context to imply something that is not the point of the information...see both Obama and Romney campaigns, and many of your posts).
The total number of people not participating in the labor market may very well be up 8,000,000 in the last 4 years, I know it has dropped to 63.6% from 65% of the population but it has been generally dropping for years. Guess what, the population has gone up 11,000,000 in the past 4 years and the population over 65 has gone up 3,200,000 in that time...the largest percentage increase of any census demographic group. Demographers expect the percentage of job market participants to continue to decline for at least a decade more as the Baby Boomers retire. You see MM, it is not kosher to spout a statistic to support an opinion without some context to explain why it is the way it is. I completely agree with you that many people have left the job market because of a sour economy over the last 5 years(though the trend has reversed in recent months), but it is also a fact that many have left the market not because they couldn't find work but because they wanted to. I plan to follow that trend myself in a year or so.
BTW: Please take another look at the BLS report on net job loss or gain since Obama took office. I come up with a net gain of 460,000 and if the Jan numbers match the Dec numbers the net gain will pass 600,000. Still away to go to have a net gain from when the decline started in Jan 2008 and continued every month for Bush's last year, but the trend is positive whether you recognize (admit it) or not.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
You are making it up Archibald
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Date:
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1/22/2013 4:48:26 PM (updated 1/22/2013 5:02:47 PM)
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I know how inconvenient it is that the labor participation rate magically dropped precipitously in the last three years because it does not fit the template. Face it dude, without those millions leaving the workforce unemployment numbers reported by the govt media would be up, up, up. Man this is a hard one for you. I understand, grasping at straws with the only so called piece of good news that you can come up with regarding your beloved messiah and his failed economic policies. I give you credit, even the looney leftists on TV don't make up as much stuff as you.
Heres the table from BLS for non farm job growth or loss by month. Add all the numbers from Jan 2009 to December 2012 and you get -368,000. And yes, I will preempt you and say all the losses came in 2009-2010 but just look at the pathetic, paltry numbers in the last two years. Most of them were below population growth. My whole point, which is not in dispute by anyone but you is that this recovery has been pathetic as evidenced by job growth, GDP, unemployment, dependence on food stamps, unemployment insurance extensions, people going on SS disability, foreclosures, etc., etc., etc. Archie, if you could only set aside your blind hatred of me and all conservatives and admit what is blindingly obvious we could probably have a more constructive dialogue.
Year Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec Annual
2002 -129 -146 -24 -84 -9 47 -100 -11 -55 121 8 -163
2003 95 -159 -213 -49 -9 0 25 -45 109 197 14 119
2004 162 44 337 249 310 81 46 122 161 348 63 134
2005 137 240 141 360 170 243 374 193 66 80 334 160
2006 283 316 283 181 14 76 209 183 157 -9 204 171
2007 236 93 190 72 139 75 -40 -18 73 79 112 89
2008 41 -84 -95 -208 -190 -198 -210 -274 -432 -489 -803 -661
2009 -818 -724 -799 -692 -361 -482 -339 -231 -199 -202 -42 -171
2010 -40 -35 189 239 516 -167 -58 -51 -27 220 121 120
2011 110 220 246 251 54 84 96 85 202 112 157 223
2012 275 259 143 68 87 45 181 192 132 137 161(P) 155(P)
P : preliminary
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| Name: |
Lifer
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| Subject: |
You are making it up Archibald
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Date:
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1/22/2013 7:40:37 PM
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The reality is even worse when you factor in how many were government jobs, which require at least five private sector jobs to compensate.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
MM do you really think
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Date:
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1/23/2013 11:08:40 PM
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since you blame the president for all the bad job results, is it fair to give Obama the blame for all the 818,000 jobs loss in Jan 2009...a month when he was only in office for the last week and half? I started my count from Feb 2009. Further, Is it even possible that some of the better months in early 2011 might be partially credited to the stimulus act which reached its maximum influence in late 2010 and early 2011?
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
MM do you really think
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Date:
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1/24/2013 10:20:10 AM (updated 1/24/2013 10:22:32 AM)
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Archie, I definitely do not blame Obama for the results in the first year or year and a half, nor do I blame Bush, tax cuts, etc. The job losses were the result of the recession which occurred because of the housing bubble bursting, said housing bubble caused by the distortion of the free markets by the CRA, Fannie and Freddie.
And yes, Obama deserves some credit for the improvement in 2011 and 2012 but the point I was trying to make is that it is a very weak recovery and could have been much better had he relied on the private sector instead of the stimulus. I am sure you have seen the numbers about how much each job created by the stimulus cost and it is much too high and much higher than the private sector would have incurred. I don't like stimulus programs because they cost too much per job, tend to be used to prop up state and local governments that were not fiscally responsible and result in too much crony capitalism (ala the billions wasted on clean energy firms). So yes it had a positive impact but when you look at the costs compared to the benefits it seems to me that there is a better way.
The point I am trying to make is that this has been the worst recovery since the Great Depression and the reason is that Obama has followed FDR's approach and it didn't work then and it has given us lackluster results now. I know I have mentioned the book The Forgotten Man by Amity Shlaes and I really think you would benefit from reading it. While you may not agree with everything you will see an eerie similarity in approach and results. I had hoped in November we would go another way but the electorate has spoken and we will have to live through another four and possibly eight years of trending toward a European-style democratic socialism which has not worked out too well for Europe and had they been forced to pay for their own defense it would have collapsed a decade or more ago. BTW, did you get my email?
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Here are some charts
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Date:
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1/24/2013 11:34:25 AM
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This first one is from the St. Louis Fed. As you can see the current GDP growth is at or near the lowest ever. 
Here is another version of the same data from JP Morgan.
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| Name: |
MrHodja
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| Subject: |
Here are some charts
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Date:
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1/24/2013 11:38:27 AM
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No graphics, just boxes containing a red X.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Dang it!
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Date:
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1/24/2013 11:40:10 AM
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Need to ask Bruce about this because I can see them on my computer. Archie, I will try to email these to you.
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| Name: |
Lifer
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| Subject: |
Here are some charts
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Date:
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1/24/2013 1:59:59 PM
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All I saw was a portrait of Archie.....a blank page.
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