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Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Why Obamacare is doomed to fail
Date:	12/2/2013 2:17:11 PM

Obamacare was always built on the backbone of young people signing up and providing the premium dollars with little payout to subsidize the costs of everyone else. even Slick Willie admitted recently that it only works if they show up. What is pretty obvious to those with the ability to think clearly is that under the current system they won't show up, and for very good reasons that have nothing to do with a lousy website experience.

Why is that? Many reasons but here are the big ones. First of all, the premium structure does not take into account the actuarial reality of being young and healthy and as a result are priced way too high. And forget the subsidies as even with them the cost for insurance is much higher than they used to be able to get from the individual market. For the typical 30 year old making $30,000 per year the subsidy is less than $100. And if married and each spouse makes $30,000 per year it goes to zero. Second, it is far cheaper to pay the tax than pay for insurance. Third, with the new law they can stay on their parent's insurance until age 26 for basically no cost. Fourth, they will correctly decide that if they do get sick they can just sign up then, a feature we long ago warned would cause adverse selection which is the death nell of any insurance program.

More importantly, the SLOTUS loving youth vote is going to be figuring this out right about the time Billary will be trying for the White House. Slick Willie with a history of dissing the black vote for SLOTUS and the youth vote figuring out they have been royally screwed will not be helpful, assuming of course the govt media doesn't convince enough low information voters. This also sets up a primary challenge from the far left like elizabeth Warren......the GOP's wet dream opponent in 2016.

And the final question, considering SLOTUS and his true desire for single payer system was this designed to fail or are they just that incompetent? I vote for the latter explanation but you never know.......

Name:	MAJ USA RET -	Reply
Subject:	Why Obamacare is doomed to fail
Date:	12/2/2013 3:04:49 PM

The 3000+ page, incomprehensible ACA (Obamacare) disobeyed the unbreakable Law of Unintended Consequences. It has wreaked havoc upon the world’s best but imperfect health care system. The imperfection could have been mitigated by well researched and deliberate measures directed at its ills… not its totality. Killing a cancer patient resolves his cancer issues… does it not?

Name:	Mike Hunt -	Reply
Subject:	WSJ. Shows it increases life expectancy
Date:	12/2/2013 10:44:42 PM

1. Switzerland > Life expectancy: 82.8 > GDP per capita: $51,227 (2nd highest) > Health spending per capita: $5,643 (3rd highest) > Pct. of adults reporting good health: 81.3 (7th highest) Switzerland had the world’s longest life expectancy at birth at nearly 83 years as of 2011 — 10 years longer than it was in 1970. Switzerland’s health care expenditure totalled $5,643 per person, the third highest out of countries measured by the OECD. Resident’s out of pocket expenditures accounted for 3.8% of household income, more than in all but 6 OECD nations. Although the Alpine country is hardly alone in providing residents with universal coverage, Switzerland’s system has frequently been compared to the Affordable Care Act because it requires residents to purchase private health insurance. Swiss residents are quite healthy, with lower cerebrovascular and cancer mortality rates than nearly all other nations measured by the OECD. Read more: Ten Countries Where People Live Longest - 24/7 Wall St. http://247wallst.com/special-report/2013/12/02/ten-countries-where-people-live-longest/#ixzz2mNbogMkj Follow us: @247wallst on Twitter | 247wallst on Facebook

Name:	MrHodja -	Reply
Subject:	WSJ. Shows it increases life expectancy
Date:	12/2/2013 11:07:49 PM

So move to Switzerland.

Name:	Mike Hunt -	Reply
Subject:	WSJ. Shows it increases life expectancy
Date:	12/3/2013 3:11:56 AM

Don't need to we now have ACA

Name:	MrHodja -	Reply
Subject:	WSJ. Shows it increases life expectancy
Date:	12/3/2013 8:28:51 AM

That you claim that an abortion of a law like ACA will achieve the results of Switzerland is laughable.

Name:	Mike Hunt -	Reply
Subject:	That came out of the old Wazoo
Date:	12/3/2013 9:11:24 AM

I quoted a learned article that compared the ACA to the health care system in Switzerland, the country with the worlds highest longevity.

You pulled your opinion out of your old Wazoo.

You have a right to your own opinion, but you don't have a right to your own facts.

Oh, I forgot your opinion is not based on facts.

Name:	Council Roc Doc -	Reply
Subject:	That came out of the old Wazoo
Date:	12/3/2013 10:19:47 AM

So Mr. Hunt, as I understand your logic, (and please correct me if I am mistaken), a country or region with a specific form of healthcare insurance is the prime factor in determining longevity of life. The average life span of an NFL football player is 55 yoa. Does that mean they have less access to healthcare than they do in Switzerland? Please provide to me your epidemiological evidence that justifies your opinion. You can conclude whatever you wish based on an article like that, but said conclusions hardly would stand up to scientific scrutiny. Stick with us, we will set you straight1

CRD

Name:	MrHodja -	Reply
Subject:	That came out of the old Wazoo
Date:	12/3/2013 11:46:51 AM

We'll see when the dust settles.

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	That came out of the old Wazoo
Date:	12/3/2013 1:33:51 PM

You are taking a 1.000 members of a hazardous occupation to argue about a health system. Do you think they would be in better health and have a longer lifespan without health insurance?

Name:	Council Roc Doc -	Reply
Subject:	That came out of the old Wazoo
Date:	12/3/2013 2:52:46 PM

Not at all. Just proving a point that life's choices make far more of an impact on life expectancy than the presence or absence of a particular health insurance policy. Does life expectancy change with a standard BC/BS policy vs one with catastrophic coverage only? I don't think so. If you had taken the entire Swiss population and placed them here where the best healthcare in the world exists, I would propose that no change in life expectancy would occur.

Name:	h_hob -	Reply
Subject:	That came out of the old Wazoo
Date:	12/3/2013 4:29:38 PM

GFY,

The real question is, "Do you think?"

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	That came out of the old Wazoo
Date:	12/3/2013 4:49:38 PM

Whike I agree with you that lifestyle plays a big part on ones health, I can't buy your theory that people would seek the same early treatment with only a Cat plan. That is a major issue with high deductibles and co-insurance on basic BC/BS coverage. People put off a visit until the condition becomes severe to avoid paying out of pocket.

When dental coverage first became available, they included cleaning as a "free coverage". The theory was get the persom to the dentist for an exam rather than wait for teeth to rot. Dental insurance was the best thing for both dentists and patients.

I fail to understand why you, a Doc. opposse health insurance for all. Regan signed into law that the ER room cannot turn anyone away regardless of ability to pay. Think of the ER visits if there were only CAT plans! As it is, in many area the majority of ER visits are for colds and other minor ailments.

Name:	Council Roc Doc -	Reply
Subject:	That came out of the old Wazoo
Date:	12/4/2013 10:00:23 AM

Again, GF, it is all in what individuals deem important. Dentistry has been in the forefront of preventive screening and treatment for decades. Medicine needed to have adopted that methodology a long time ago, but buried their heads in the sand. The question is, why would someone wait until they had dental insurance before going to the dentists for a routine cleaning and periodic radiographs? The cost is similar to the price of a Gucci bag, or a couple of rounds of golf, or a couple of manni/pedis. People chose not to set aside monthly income for healthcare costs, assuming either it was someone else's responsibility or they would roll the dice and pay when necessary.

The discussion as to why I and the majority of healthcare providers are against universal care is much too complicated to discuss in a forum such as this. I have a private practice and also give back to my community by volunteering as an attending surgeon at a major Atlanta teaching institution. I have given away my services for going on 2 decades now, seen patients at ER's and in my office with no insurance, so the notion that just because individuals had no insurance meant they were prohibited from seeking medical care is a croc that you on the left have used to justify governmental takeover of 1/6th of the economy. There were certainly methods available to make healthcare more efficient for those without insurance for justifiable reasons, but asking me to not only treat patients at government set fees and also ask me to pay for someone else's health insurance is a little much. Hence, you will find a paucity of providers willing to sign on to various plans, and you will not be able to force us to. You will be able to make the choice of seeing providers who were trained either here or abroad. It is simply what you will be willing to pay for healthcare. Afterall, it is your responsibility, not a governmental perk.

Name:	MrHodja -	Reply
Subject:	That came out of the old Wazoo
Date:	12/4/2013 10:23:00 AM

Well said, Doc. The best summary I've seen.

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	That came out of the old Wazoo
Date:	12/4/2013 3:58:21 PM

Doc, you are to be commended for your service to others. However, it is my opinion that in this great country no one should have to provide free medical treatment. When one visits a doc, the first thing they are asked is how will you pay? Free is not one of the options offered. Nor, should it be.

I assume you opposse Medicare as it is a single payer health plan. Yet, it has extended the life of seniors and dramatically improved their ability to carry on their daily activities. Your parents, mine, and those of every Conservative have enjoyed the benefits knowing they can access medical treatment at age 65 including pre exisiting conditions. It is hard to imagine this country without Medicare.

Name:	Council Rock Doc -	Reply
Subject:	That came out of the old Wazoo
Date:	12/5/2013 12:39:03 PM

Regarding Medicare, better have a supplemental policy. And you are mistaken if you don't think that for a class of indivuals, healthcare will most certainly be free. Subsidies will pay for their premiums and they will continue to have no skin in the game, hence will never vote out the hands that feed them. As for me, I would rather have had a system whereby below a certain income level, individuals would receive via the taxpayor one lump sum of money. They can do with that sum what they wish. If they value Direct TV over healthcare, so be it. When the money runs dry, tough luck. THis would eliminate all governmental handout programs and put responsibility back where it belongs. Pipe dream, but Milton Friedman advocated this type of program in the late 70's. I am amazed at his foresight.

Name:	h_hob -	Reply
Subject:	That came out of the old Wazoo
Date:	12/5/2013 11:13:35 PM

Mike Hunt,
Can you tell me what disbarred means?

Name:	h_hob -	Reply
Subject:	WSJ. Shows it increases life expectancy
Date:	12/5/2013 11:15:30 PM

Mike Hunt,
Can you tell me what disbarred means?

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