Name:	copperline -	Reply
Subject:	Trump sit-rep
Date:	10/16/2016 12:12:07 PM

Let’s review where we are.

Donald Trump is now saying the election is rigged against him, evidenced by the pounding he is taking for decades to videotaped interviews & nightclub adventures he used to make himself famous over the years.   After a year of free media attention during the primaries when his exaggerations and ill-founded statements brought him headlines without paying a dime for media coverage, he is now saying that the entire news media has it in for him.

He is now flailing so badly that his statements are erratic & even less intelligible than before.  He wants a urine screen drug test to be performed before the next debate.   Imagine that.    I don’t think he can lower the dignity of Presidential elections any further.   Then again, he has surprised us before.

His poll numbers are tanking, and what support he had from reasonable/moderate Republicans, and some evangelicals, is vanishing.   Some Christian leaders of high standing (Falwell, Graham) continue to stand by him in spite of his distinctly un-christian behaviors, embarrassing themselves and demonstrating that for some Christians… their religion has become  more a political party than spiritual guide.

Russia, we are told, is about to declare nuclear war on us if Clinton is elected.   This is a mortal & existential threat to the survival of the United States & the world.     To deal with this threat, they say we need to place a real estate salesman & TV show host in charge of our military forces, even though this man has never been in ANY elected office before, has no military experience, & believes he is smarter than the Generals anyway.   Trump supporters would have us believe that his superior intellect, his history of amassing a great deal of personal wealth, and his mature decision making ability will be the only way we can survive the threat of World War III which will happen soon after Clinton is elected.     Russia is threatening to kill us all, therefore we need to elect a man with no experience or qualifications to defend us.   That’s logical?

Clearly, Russia would prefer a Trump presidency.   Why would be the harm in agreeing with Putin on  this?  Right?

There is no logic to the Trump candidacy anymore, no reasoned thinking.   For Donald & his hard-core supporters, it is time to cry foul and ramp up the conspiracy theories to explain what has happened to his campaign for POTUS.   This is the end of a long line of hysterical allegations including that Obama was not a citizen, that POTUS is a Muslim determined to destroy us, that HRC murders people, that HRC wants to let terrorists invade the country while she takes away all our guns.   Give me a break.   How much exaggeration can people believe before they scratch their heads and say ‘wait a minute, that sounds like BS to me’?

Trump supporters are a determined bunch, many unwilling to admit they were flat out wrong to support a Charlatan in the first place.  Now that he is demolishing the party that nominated him, most likely dealing a death blow to GOP credibility for years to come, Trumpsters are looking to blame anyone but Donald….or themselves…for not giving serious thought to whether this guy was worthy of the highest office in the world.  

Of course, Donald is looking to blame anyone but himself, too.  Notice that pattern.  He always does ......& his fans are just following his lead.

Name:	architect -	Reply
Subject:	Copper
Date:	10/16/2016 1:26:23 PM (updated 10/16/2016 1:33:40 PM)

You have posted a well thought out and and illustrated analysis of the death spiral of the Trump faux campaign.  An synopsis that explains the situation with great accuracy.  You have been especially on the mark in pointing out exactly where blame should be placed for this fiasco...it is most emphatically not the media, not the Clinton/Wall Street/Hollywood/liberal conspiracy, not the debate moderators, not SNL, not a faulty mic, not the big money special interests, Not a ''rigged system'', not the DC establishment, not the women who have come forward with accusations, not the GOP ''Leadership'', not Paul Ryan, nor John McCain, nor Jeff Flake nor any other politician..Trump knows and every Trump supporter knows it is a WHO and not a WHAT to blame but cannot bring themselves to say it. You are so on the money you will enrage the vast majority of the posters on this forum.

Name:	Buteye -	Reply
Subject:	Trump sit-rep
Date:	10/16/2016 2:16:38 PM

For the sake of brevity, I will comment on your paragraph about hysterical allegations. Although unlikely. it is still possible that the allegations could be true. How many deaths have happened to people that were connected in some way to the Clinton dynasty? As to Obama being Muslim, the ring that Obama wore on his ring finger during college appears to be the same ring he still wears today. There seems to be substantial evidence that the inscription on the ring says, "There is no God but Allah".

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	Buteye and the Evidence
Date:	10/16/2016 2:48:11 PM

"substantial evidence" Hey dude, like it was posted on the Internet so it must be true????........

The Other Substantial Evidence

Name:	copperline -	Reply
Subject:	reply to Buteye
Date:	10/16/2016 2:53:37 PM

“Although unlikely, it is still possible that the allegations are true”

Good Lord.  Then you go on to repeat two outrageous & illogical allegations without any basis of proof.   It seems to me that ‘just because it’s unlikely doesn’t mean it isn’t true’ could be the last campaign slogan ever.   It completely explains the willingness of some voters to devote themselves blindly to  Trump.

If Trump supporters don’t need to apply a standard of proof to what they believe (and vote for), then I think you have made the case for me.

Name:	Buteye -	Reply
Subject:	reply to Buteye
Date:	10/16/2016 3:41:58 PM (updated 10/16/2016 3:55:43 PM)

Trump may have his shortcomings, but I can't bring myself to vote for Hillary because the only reason she is even a candidate for President is because Obama, the DOJ, the FBI, and the news media have made a "mockery" out of our justice system that applies to everyone "except" Hillary. As a result, the last eight years of Obama and the sinful "protection" of Hillary has made America the "laughing stock" of the world. If you know the right people you can get away with murder.

Name:	Mack -	Reply
Subject:	Nice Burning of Trump But
Date:	10/16/2016 7:54:40 PM

You constantly attack Trump. No deviation.

You never defend Hillary, and Forum members do not force you to do so. All we ever hear is Trump bad. And we defend.

So, take an opportunity to use your research via HuffAndPuff to conduct a similar analysis of Hillary. Use logical presentation bullets just like you did with Trump. Maybe you could sell some of us??

According to many polls Hills ain't selling so good these days. Smells a little rotten..

Name:	wix -	Reply
Subject:	Mack,
Date:	10/16/2016 8:45:53 PM

Copper-krap* is incapable of having logical thoughts so don't expect anything from him except a display of verbosity that he copies off some liberal idiot website.  I find it really strange that THE HILDA B......H has only three fans that post on this forum.  With all the cash HILDA is throwing away paying posters to dominate forums such as this, I am beginning to believe all three of these idiots are being paid by the HILDA machine.....

Name:	copperline -	Reply
Subject:	My take on Hillary
Date:	10/17/2016 9:24:17 AM

At this point in the election, we have a choice between two candidates.  When the election started, I was a Sanders supporter although I never thought he could win the nomination.   Now, it's down to these two and I have to give  full-throated support to Clinton as the only reasonable choice.   I don't have any regrets about doing so.

My take on HRC is that she has been thru the wars in DC for 30+ years, and has the scars to prove it.    She also is the most vetted candidate in modern history because of that.   She has had numerous allegations made and investigations carried out ... and none of them have revealed the kind of criminal activity that her opponents continue to believe in....in spite of the lack of evidence & repeated findings. Much of what is alleged to have been done by her is simply exaggeration or the continuance of charges that have been disproven.   When people complain that she is evasive, defensive on some issues, I believe that A) she is a trained attorney  and B) she has learned from experience that attacks come constantly and she would be foolish to be anything but cautious in her statements.   Over a 30 year career, she has been close to many crisis situations that can now be scrutinized with the benefit of the rear view mirror.   Any number of those can be dredged up and slung back at her.  But on balance, and with the proof of history, she has come out on top.

Some of what is alleged to be horrible about her is just the way life has to be.   When a woman's husband cheats on her, I really don't expect her to embrace the other women as victims & protect them from criticism.  I guess people think she should have divorced her husband, but that was her choice to make.  

So her background of work experience makes her the most qualified candidate by a mile.   

Is she 'the establishment candidate'?    Yes, she is, ......sort of.    I feel that the conservative agenda has dominated US politics since Reagan very effectively... while a progressive agenda has made few shifts in our domestic policies that are very dramatic over that same period of time.  

This presidential race could be competitive if not for the outlandish choice of Trump by conservative voters.   It was outrageous to think that an untrained, untested guy who made his bones as a rich & arrogant playboy during his youth... then as a deceptive & unscrupulous real estate mogul who hid behind ample lawyers to get over on his investors & business associates, and finally as a larger than life TV game show host.   Conservatives bought a slickly packaged media creation in Donald Trump and convinced themselves that they were voting for their savior.   His appearances on Howard Stern and as a professional wrestling character didn't seem particularly disqualifying to them.   The fact that he keeps his taxes a secret, makes unfounded & poorly thought out statements, and is prone to make angry threats doesn't raise red flags to true believers either.   All of that is evidence of denial, double-think, blind devotion or just having given up on rational thinking in my opinion.

Here is a final thought:   supporters like Trump because they think he will "disrupt the system" and this will automatically bring about a refreshing change in the way US politics works.    I think electing someone who promises to create chaos while having no plans (or experience) for what comes next is flat out foolish.   It's like invading a country & removing their government without a strategy for what happens when we do so.   (oh, yeah, we did that.....)

But we have a history of impulsive choices based purely on emotion in this country.   I say that anyone who wants 'disruption' without thought to what comes next is dancing on the edge of a cliff.   Too much is at stake here to vote for anyone except Hillary Clinton.

Name:	Mack -	Reply
Subject:	Truly Sorry I Asked
Date:	10/17/2016 11:10:57 AM

You cleared her of any and all wrongdoing in one paragraph. No proof of anything and it never happened. Wow.

Name:	architect -	Reply
Subject:	Basically correct, but change ''her'' to ''him''
Date:	10/17/2016 12:50:37 PM (updated 10/17/2016 12:54:37 PM)

and have your post referring to any number of posts from the rabid Trumpistas on this forum and that post would also be correct.  Unlike Copper, I'm voting for her and then holding on and hoping for the best!

Name:	phil -	Reply
Subject:	Buteye and the Evidence
Date:	10/17/2016 3:35:09 PM

From your snopes link

We shared the above picture with a small survey of six different persons with fluency in written Arabic, and all of them said the pattern displayed on the ring appeared to be an abstract one with no discernible meaning in Arabic. 

is it a pattern or is it Arabic?

http://www.dcclothesline.com/2015/10/22/another-obama-mystery-he-wore-a-wedding-ring-as-a-single-man/

But what is odd is that Obama had worn a ring on his wedding ring finger long before he married Mooch in 1992, since at least his days as a student at Occidental College, CA (1979-81).