Name:	Buteye -	Reply
Subject:	Hypothetical
Date:	12/1/2016 1:43:19 AM (updated 12/1/2016 1:48:19 AM)

Assume you and your family are at a local high school football game. At the beginning of the game, the band plays the National Anthem as  the American Flag is being raised. Then out of no where a person starts to shinny up the flag pole and sets the flag on fire. Do you accept it as some "idiot" protesting his anguish toward America and the patriotism that men and women have fought wars and died for in defending our nation? The Constitution guarantees the freedom of speech. "Speech" is generally referred to as "the expression of or the ability to express thoughts and feelings by articulate sounds. Merriam-Webster dictionary defines "speech" as the communication or expression of thoughts in spoken words; exchange of spoken words; conversation; something that is spoken; and the like. It is the Supreme Court that brought forth a "broader" definition of "speech" which has created the types of the violent dissent that we are witnessing today. If a person decides to deface the American Flag that represents everything that America stands for, there should be some law or other means of punishment for such action. Are we saying that it is allright for any legal or illegal immigrant to burn our flag if they so desire? I dare say that most of those who have immigrated to this country do not look at our flag and hold it in the same high regard as does a true American. Most of them have no clue about how America fought for the freedom we have today. If I fly the American Flag on the back of my pickup truck, does that give some one the right to set it on fire?

Name:	RHH -	Reply
Subject:	Hypothetical
Date:	12/1/2016 6:40:23 AM

No one has the right to destroy someone else's property. If you buy a flag and stage your own protest that may be distasteful but shouldn't be illegal .

Name:	wix -	Reply
Subject:	SNOWFLAKE returns........
Date:	12/1/2016 8:49:28 AM

Well, well, our first snowflake dimokrap chooses the most despicable stand of all liberal idiots to return to the forum......flag burning!!  How cute.  

Name:	lucky67 -	Reply
Subject:	Hypothetical
Date:	12/1/2016 9:22:01 AM

bet they wouldnt last very long doing that in China or Russia

Name:	Shortbus -	Reply
Subject:	antithetical
Date:	12/1/2016 10:06:23 AM

Scalia was for flag burning.  He said if it was up to me, I'd bust the heads of all sandal wearing offenders.

But outlawing burning the flag is a slippery slope on speech. I agree with Scalia and not Trump.

Same thing happening with Trump stickers.  Did you see the Trump sticker car inda hood that lasted 30 minutes?

It's like guns.  There is no gun problem if it shoots.

It's the morons that are the problem in all cases.

Name:	phil -	Reply
Subject:	Hypothetical
Date:	12/1/2016 10:08:36 AM (updated 12/1/2016 10:12:52 AM)

If he climbs the pole at a game and sets the flag on fire - he goes to jail for a minumum of vandalism, destruction of property, arson, lots of things that the cops can dream up other then just his "protest".  

If he brings his own and jumps up and down on the sideline and accidentaly sets himself and the flag on fire, hopefully the fire department will put him out with the big hose or those heavy rubber flappers.  Then take him to jail for endangering the public etc.

and even better if he does it here in Alabama - violation of the burn ban due to the lack of rain, jail time + fees.  Thankfully the rain helped some but we need more.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Hypothetical
Date:	12/1/2016 4:07:55 PM

Actually, I think a lot of naturalized citizens do hold the flag in high regard and wouldn't dream of burning it. Because of what they went through to get citizenship.  I think it is a lot of spoiled Americans who mostly do the burning (except in other countries).  I don't consider burning the flag to be "freedom of speech", no matter how the SC ruled. I think it is fine if someone wants to set up a podium or a soapbox and preach anarchy and the end of the world or write articles all day long condeming the President. 

Name:	Buteye -	Reply
Subject:	Hypothetical
Date:	12/1/2016 4:53:17 PM (updated 12/1/2016 5:00:10 PM)

After thinking about it I tend to agree with you that naturalized citizens probably  do show more respect for our flag. I feel that the democrats are responsible for misleading todays young brats into believeing that the government owes them a free college education and forgiveness of their college debt. As I have said before, it is not the government who would be giving them a free education. The money for a free education would be funded by the tax payers who understand that if you "want" something you must be willing to "work" for it. Luckily, Donald Trump was able to light a fire under we "deplorables" who in turn, were able to burst the "bubbles" that Democrats have been "blowing" for way too long. Democrats will promise anything to gain your vote.

Name:	Lifer -	Reply
Subject:	True story
Date:	12/1/2016 8:02:14 PM

On the fourth of July as part of the celebration and fireworks I hold a flag burning  for any desecrate flags. I always have one from flag island and sometimes another from elsewhere. My favorite ceremony is to cut or tear the flag along the stripes and burn them individually. I usually pay them out to frinds/family and we place them in and make a statement of gratitude to those who fought and died for Old Glory. The field of stars goes last.

Several years ago we met some Australian neighbors and became friends. They have been here nearly twenty years and have one son who was born here, thus a citizen. They tell horror stories of dealing with immigration over the years and are still working toward duel citizenship for the rest of his family. They are more patriotic and love this country more than most, like many immigrants. They have lived elsewhere and understand what we have and how precious it is. He came originally on a temporary year to 18 months assignment with his company,  fell in love and moved his family here for a permanent position

Well back to the point of the post.  The first year they came for fireworks we gathered around the fire pit for the ceremony. The stripes had been distributed and the I presented him with the field of stars and asked if he would do the honors. The man teared up and choked up but then proceeded to speak on what it means to be American. I won't do details but to suffice to say there wasn't a dry eye in the crowd before he was done. A great memory.

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	Hypothetical
Date:	12/1/2016 10:23:01 PM

Like most, I am bothered when I see someone burning the flag. But, it is interesting if you ask the VFW to dispose of  a flag they burn it.

Name:	Shortbus -	Reply
Subject:	Hypothetical
Date:	12/1/2016 11:26:23 PM (updated 12/1/2016 11:27:53 PM)

And the difference is the speach.    BRAVO Fishy.

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	Hypothetical
Date:	12/2/2016 1:36:07 AM

Is that speach like s  peach or did you really mean speech? And, yes there is a speech. Shorty, how you doing???  Cheers.

Name:	Shortbus -	Reply
Subject:	Hypoethical
Date:	12/2/2016 8:23:07 AM (updated 12/2/2016 9:03:47 AM)

Ran out of spelling meds.  Turned into a Democrat just before midnight.  Started stealing Tump signs and crying.

Name:	Lifer -	Reply
Subject:	Useless debate
Date:	12/2/2016 9:18:07 AM

It is really simple. The protesters right to free expression is near absolute. There is however, no right for anyone to not be offended. Flag burners are the true deplorables and if I see anyone burning a flag in protest I will confront them and not in a nice non-violent way most likely. This whole nobody can be offended cr@p is just that, cr@p. I love what the immigration judge told the citizenship applicants in Texas, if the American flag offends you,  find another country.

Name:	phil -	Reply
Subject:	Hypothetical
Date:	12/2/2016 10:05:56 AM

Difference is how it is handled - with honor and respect, not as wow let me wipe my bum with it and kick it around the street and set a match to it as a show of protest.  To me someone who wants to use the flag as a way to protest is an idiot and should be taken behind the nearest woodshed for re-education by some vets or other patriotic citizens.

I have a flag that during high wind the bracket on my pier broke - we found it later in the weeds floating.  It is currently folded and awaiting time when my son in JROTC can arrange for it to be properly taken care of, it is on hold till this burn ban lifts.

http://faq.vfw.org/faq/index.php?View=entry&EntryID=497

*SUGGESTED PROCEDURE FOR INDIVIDUALS TO USE IN PRIVATE OR PUBLIC FOR DISPOSING OF A TORN, SOILED, OR BADLY FADED U.S. FLAG.

 The Flag should be folded in its customary manner. (See VFW Ritual.)- It is important that the fire be sizeable and of sufficient intensity to ensure complete burning of the Flag.

 Place the Flag on the fire.

 The individual(s) can come to attention, salute the Flag, recite the Pledge of Allegiance and have a brief period of silent reflection.

 After the Flag is completely consumed, the fire should then be safely extinguished and the ashes buried.

 Please make sure you are conforming to local/state fire codes or ordinances.

 (Approved for distribution by the VFW National Citizenship Education and Community Service Committee, September 18, 2000.)

 If you have any questions, please contact our flag expert at tbeauchamp@vfw.org 816-756-3390 x 287

Name:	Lifer -	Reply
Subject:	Hypothetical
Date:	12/2/2016 10:31:48 AM

That is the VFW method but not the only approved or appointed method. I got my stripes and stars method from a former Scout Master with two Eagle scout sons, one who graduated ROTC and is now an Air Force officer. Any burning is acceptable as long g as it is done with dignity and respect. One of my pet peeves is watching TV or movies and seeing flags hung on  vertical but with the stars in the upper right, the equivalent of hanging one upside down o  horizontal. I see it all the time unfortunately. Some show I watched had the flag backwards in a military command center which immediately turned me off and caused me to switch to something else. If they can't get that right nothing else holds credibility to me. I understand it is fiction but even so I demand a certain amount of reality and that is just unacceptable error. They obviously had no real military advisors on the staff.

Name:	phil -	Reply
Subject:	Hypothetical
Date:	12/2/2016 1:07:20 PM (updated 12/2/2016 1:11:59 PM)

Was not suggesting that it was the only - GF referenced the VFW format in that it was burnt as well and that was acceptable while the protest burnings was not acceptable.

Many places have their own versions but as you said that it contains dignity and respect - not being a idiot using it as a "statement" when half of them do not even know what they are protesting.

If someone wants to make a statement come onto my property and try to burn my flag while being an a$$hat - you will get a return statement and I am willing to bet you wont like it.

I can also see added benifits to the version you posted in which it was cut before burning - my opinion would be that there is less chance of a fire that is not hot enough to fully burn the flag while it is folded - sort of like when you try to burn a magazine - pages close together makes it much harder to destory as well as for larger flags it would help to keep the flames down and be more managable vs a fireball.

Name:	phil -	Reply
Subject:	Hypothetical
Date:	12/2/2016 1:21:54 PM

Dont get me started on movie/TV  mistakes - intentional or otherwise.  Some are so glaring, its like how did that even get through basic review, miltary movies are some of the worst as there is always a correct way to do it.  

My son started JROTC this year got his first promotion yesterday and he is always screaming about how people are wearing their uniforms incorrectly etc.  

Name:	phil -	Reply
Subject:	Useless debate
Date:	12/2/2016 1:26:39 PM

Another one I just can not understand - you want to come to this country so d@mn badly - because this country is so offensive??