| Name: |
Jim Dandy
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| Subject: |
Pelosi's Nose
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Date:
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5/14/2009 3:48:53 PM
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Is growing! The CIA mis-led me......... BS
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Pelosi's Nose
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Date:
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5/14/2009 5:01:06 PM
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Did you hear her press conference? She has really backed herself into a corner with this one and it looks like old scores with her fellow Dems may be settled. If she wants to persecute former Bush administration people for their role in this then she is equally culpable. I frankly believe they did the right thing in supporting the enhanced interrogation techniques. But she can't have it both ways. She was caught in a lie and is now apparently going to war with Panetta and the CIA. Not a smart move.
You can only come to one of two conclusions: 1) she was either incompetent and negligent in her duties as head of the intelligence committee; or 2) she is out and out lying. I believe the latter to be the case and watching her body language in the briefing leads me to believe she is a liar.
My prediction is this will all go away as it should. If it doesn't she is toast.
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| Name: |
Jim Dandy
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| Subject: |
Pelosi's Nose
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Date:
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5/14/2009 5:18:33 PM
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I wish she would end up toast and it would all go away. Nice double-shot.
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| Name: |
Mack
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| Subject: |
Please..Please ...
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Date:
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5/14/2009 8:39:41 PM
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Stop.
You are interrupting the latest versions of programming for "Reality TV" in Prime Time.
It is very informative and educates viewers.
I could be wrong, but, all the Networks carry it, so, it must be OK?
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
How Many?
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Date:
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5/15/2009 8:54:30 AM
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Marteinsteini Man I went to my grandaughter's pre-K graduation yesterday afternoon, what a hoot, (you would have probably found it silly and boring), and to dinner with friends last night so I didn't read your Pelosi comments until after my run (at my age still calling it running proves I'm an optimist) this morning.
You conclude two possibilities: (1) Incompetence/negligence or (2) Lying. How can a man of superior intellect such as yourself not know that the 3d possibility is that she is telling the truth, at least in her mind (I agree with Neil Boortz that it's only a lie if you know its a lie). Even my "pea brain"(credit WW) can see that.
Now I agree with you that she is probably lying, but it is also possible she is not. It is also possible that the whole truth is in some complicated convergence of all three.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
How Many?
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Date:
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5/15/2009 9:06:09 AM
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I suppose it is possible she is a sociopath and doesn't know the truth from a lie. I have taken a few courses on reading body language and that is what leads me to believe she is lying and she knows it. That was a pathetic dissembling press conference and as you say below she is probably lying. But it is certainly possible.
Gee, maybe the lawyers and others in the Bush administration should take the same tact and claim that the memo's of meetings, their own memo's and the CIA are all lying....... Face it dude, she is in a pickle because she is an incompetent, lying boob and has finally been taken to task by the media. Calling the CIA liars, now that is dumb........
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Pelosi is a shrewd cookie, raised in Baltimore politics before heading west. She miscalculated on 3 fronts. #1 - Thought the media would spin her comments in her favor, did not happen. #2 Thought Obama would cover her back, did not happen. #3 Thought her fellow Democrats would align themselves with her, did not happen. She's being hung out to dry and I would like to see her political savvy pitted against Obama for the entire summer. Pass me the popcorn, extra butter please!
One other question, how in the world can the CIA get any guality people working for them, when in the face of accusations of lying, providing false intelligence, incompetence, etc the top brass at the CIA never says enough is enough and defend the organization and it's people? The Democrats must be spending alot to keep the CIA's mouth shut while they (the CIA) cover for Democratic incompetence. Maybe times are changing. Has the CIA had enough? In that case, I sure would not want to be Pelosi with a CIA bullseye painted on my back.
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| Name: |
alahusker
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| Subject: |
Don't know if she is lying,
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Date:
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5/15/2009 5:38:09 PM
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but architech, would you agree that we ought to know the truth?? Would you concede that calling our frontline intelligence 'liars' has consequences for the organization and, potentially, my grand kids security?? Do you want to know if EIT actually saved us from another domestic attack?? Transparency in government seemed like a good idea.. let's see if it's forthcoming..
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
Don't know if she is lying,
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Date:
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5/16/2009 4:00:37 PM
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I completely agree that we need the truth. Problem is the President, the Intellegence community and the Republicans in Congress have shown little or no interest in taking any steps to get to the facts. Seems only the "liberal" Democrats in Congress are pushing to actually get to the truth via a non-partisan commission of inquiry.
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
Don't know if she's lying,but
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Date:
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5/16/2009 4:11:10 PM
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Remember all those in on the briefings are prohibited from taking notes or from discussing the briefing info with anyone except other participants, and no minutes of the meeting are taken. Now try to recall all the specifics, the comments made to you and by you at a particular meeting you attended 6 years ago when the meeting was not recorded, no minutes were produced and you took no notes.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
Don't know if she's lying,but
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Date:
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5/16/2009 5:41:11 PM
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I would agree that we can't expect someone to recall all the specifics but lets be realistic, if you were vehemently opposed to EIT or torture you would surely take note of that and object wouldn't you? The inconvenient truth is she is lying......
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| Name: |
Talullahhound
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| Subject: |
There is a Remote 4th
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Date:
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5/16/2009 9:47:42 PM
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possibility. That they never told her in the first place, because they didn't want her to know what is going on. You know, People in the Departments are sometimes very careful what they tell people on the Hill, because they can't trust them not to leak it to the media or create a bruhaha to try to get it stopped. As crafty a politician as she is, she has nothing on other crafty politicans of the opposite persuasion.
I'm no fan of Nancy Pelosi, and would be happy to see her go. Maybe she wasn't smart enough to understand what she was being told. However, she wouldn't be the first politican to claim "no knowledge" when it looked like they might be culpable too.
I don't think anyone should be prosecuted for what happened. I don't necessarily agree with EIT, unless I had more facts about what we got versus what we would have gotten from other means, but it happened, and I think it is in the best interest of the national security to believe that everyone acted with the best of intentions at the time, given the information that they had.
Looking back never seems to get us anywhere.
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| Name: |
MrHodja
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| Subject: |
There is a Remote 4th
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Date:
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5/16/2009 11:12:48 PM
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"Looking back never seems to get us anywhere."
The why, pray tell, do we study history?
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
That's no 4th possibility
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Date:
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5/17/2009 9:18:42 AM
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That's what she is claiming and someone is lying. It's either the CIA or Pelosi and I believe it is Pelosi. Hound, sometimes you are so "open minded" that your mind is completely closed to simple explanations.
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| Name: |
rude evin
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| Subject: |
That's no 4th possibility
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Date:
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5/17/2009 11:26:09 AM
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Paraphasing the lyrics of that ol' country music song 'if you don't believe in something you'll fall for anything'.....
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| Name: |
Talullahhound
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| Subject: |
Why Indeed?
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Date:
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5/17/2009 9:59:03 PM
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Who was it that said that the only thing that we learn from history is that we don't learn anything from history?
Do you remember in the military when you constantly generated those "lessons learned" reports? Did anyone actually ever read the things?
My point is that I don't think that there is anything to be gained by prosecuting Bush Administration officials and dissecting who did what and who knew what when. What does it change? We are where we are.
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| Name: |
Talullahhound
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| Subject: |
That's no 4th possibility
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Date:
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5/17/2009 10:01:30 PM
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I don't like her, but what is that to be gained? Does it change what happened? No. I think ALCON ought to just let it go.
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| Name: |
Talullahhound
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| Subject: |
Thankfully
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Date:
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5/17/2009 10:03:09 PM
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I don't have to take my life's wisdom from Country music songs.
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| Name: |
MartiniMan
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| Subject: |
That's no 4th possibility
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Date:
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5/18/2009 12:14:32 AM
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I agree with you Hound but if this is truly an issue for people then it is an equal opportunity issue. If Bush, Cheney, the attorneys, etc. are guilty of some crime then so is Pelosi and every other member of the intelligence committee. The point is you are right, but the wacko left is looking for blood and Pelosi is equally culpable. Let's end it now.......
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| Name: |
architect
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| Subject: |
That's no 4th possibility
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Date:
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5/18/2009 7:26:48 AM
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Why end it now? Getting the truth is a good thing. Boehner puffs and blows but falls far short of calling for a thorough airing. If everybody is so sure Pelosi is lying and want her to take a hit we can only do it with a complete impartial inquiry but so far the President, the intellegency community and the Republicans in congress are opposed. In an amazing convergence only Newt and the most liberal Democrats including Pelosi are pushing getting to the truth. It is for obvious different reasons and a gamble for both but I say cut the cards and get er done.
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So you get the truth (which will not likely be made public since most of it is classified). Now what do you do? Do you want to see Bush and Cheney prosecuted? Others?
And if you do, then what? Put them in jail if they are convicted? It will take years and resources to do that. And at the end of the day, what will we have gained?
If this was merely a point of law, it would be one thing. I have my beliefs about how it likely went down. We already know the facts, but what those facts mean in terms of US national security are likely very subjective. The law on these points is likely not very specific.
And if you punish those who made the analysis and came to the conclusion that what we did was legal -- where do you suppose that will leave such analysis in the future?
Just remember that hindsight, not foresight, is always 20/20.
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| Name: |
lakngulf
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| Subject: |
OK
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Date:
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5/18/2009 4:01:39 PM
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I think you are being generous to give some people's hindsight the 20/20 mark.
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| Name: |
MrHodja
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| Subject: |
OK
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Date:
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5/18/2009 7:20:50 PM
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But you said it didn't do any good to study history because nobody pays any attention to the lessons that should have been learned.....
Cheers!!
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This has nothing to do with history. This has to do with dragging public officials through the mud and further damaging our national security.
Were you a history major?
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| Name: |
MrHodja
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| Subject: |
OK
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Date:
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5/18/2009 10:00:47 PM
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Hardly. I have trouble telling Charlemaigne (sp?) from Old Main....
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