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Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Messiah strongarm of CBO?
Date:	7/22/2009 12:44:22 PM

Apparently his highness summoned the head of CBO to the Oval Office to talk about the CBO conclusion that the health care will reduce health care quality and will cost trillions. For those of you who do not know, the CBO is NOT an executive branch agency and is allegedly non-partisan although the head is appointed by the Speaker. It will be interesting to see if the CBO does a flip flop on their analysis which in my view will be proof positive that he strong armed them.

I seem to recall the howls of protest from the left when Dick Cheney went over to CIA (an executive branch agency) to meet about Iraq intelligence. I wonder where the howls are with a President that had a meeting with the CBO. I know, I am going to hear from all the apologists that this is nothing new, he was just asking questions, blah, blah, blah. We will see if the CBO flip flops or holds their ground.

BTW, I searched both google and bing and didn't see any stories about Bush meeting with the head of the CBO in the middle of a contentious discussion on their estimates.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Messiah strongarm of CBO?
Date:	7/22/2009 3:33:29 PM

the CBO tends to be a hard-nosed organization. I doubt he'll have much luck strong-arming them.

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	I agree about CBO
Date:	7/22/2009 4:10:08 PM

They do seem to be very independent and that frankly is what gives them their credibility. I do find it unsurprising but ironic the lack of concern about the Executive Branch potentially trying to strongarm CBO. If GW had done this it would be all we hear about from the government media. Contrast that with the hysteria we got from Cheney visiting another Executive Branch agency.

I don't expect that to change but I like pointing out their hypocrisy.

Name:	JustAGuy -	Reply
Subject:	Messiah strongarm of CBO?
Date:	7/22/2009 5:57:20 PM

Well, here is how the Director of CBO described the meeting.

URL: Blog - Director of CBO

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	Messiah strongarm of CBO?
Date:	7/22/2009 6:31:48 PM

Sure doesn't appear that Obama broke the Director's arm. I would have to assume based on Martini's prospective, the CBO Director was intimidated and is lying. Thanks to Martini for advancing a negative projection on virtually everything Obama says or suggests. At least, this was not some clandestine meeting like a few that Cheney had. Maybe, the Right has a real problem with transparency in government.

Name:	Yankee06 -	Reply
Subject:	Messiah strongarm of CBO?
Date:	7/22/2009 6:43:30 PM

CBO is a great organization. I've used its analysis many times.
-Both parties have tried over the years to brow beat its analysts into political conformity. Rarely has it been able to do so on the big issues.
-If Congressmen and senators don't seem to understand the independent role of CBO, CBO lifers do, ..and they try to pass this heritage on to new politically appointed leadership.
-The present leadership has been drafted from the Brookings Institute. Brookngs has nothing but top-notch analysts. However, most independent assessments of Brookings is that it is consistently left of Center.
-Friends tell me that the new CBO Director, his Asst Dir for Economic Analysis, his special assistants, and many others have all recently arrived from Brookings. Although they are all well-accredited and respected analysts their past history is a little left of center. (If the Republicans were in chagre of teh Congress the Director would probably have come from teh Heritage Foundation, a right of center think tank.)
-The big problem as I see it with the Prez inviting teh CBO Director over to a White House group-think on the new heath plan is that it brings teh CBO into the formulation/development of policy as a player, and thus CBO will have a stake in seeing a successful outcome to the effort and will be under pressure, overt or subconscious, to be a team player in producing that succes. That IS NOT THE COB's MISSION! The CBO is to provide congress with independent assessments of costs of proposed plans, period.
-Let's hope the new CBO Director can protect the CBO mission.
(NOte: President Obama's staff economics guru (Orczzag -Sp?) is the previous CBO Director, --he should have known better than to put the new Director in this predicament.

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Messiah strongarm of CBO?
Date:	7/22/2009 7:20:21 PM

If you look at my post you will see that I reserved judgment if and when the CBO does a reversal of their indictment of the health care plan. And it is an indictment....it won't lower costs and it won't improve health care and it will cost trillions for those of us who actually pay taxes.

But please tell me you don't expect me to believe a blog from a political appointee. He seemed more like a school girl giddy at meeting the Messiah than a serious person. "People have asked whether it was exciting to meet the President and be in the Oval Office: Yes, and my kids will be jealous when they get back from summer camp and hear about it." I can just see them jumping up and down and shrieking with excitement. Remember, he is a leftist appointed by Nancy Pelosi, not some low level civil servant. He serves at the pleasure of the speaker and if he were pressured do you really think he would amdit it? I do find it interesting that he had to put the disclaimer at the end of the blog....methinks thou doth protest too much.

The real question is what pressure he will try to apply on the staffers at CBO to change their view of this awful piece of legislation. If they don't suddenly backtrack on their analysis then my question is answered in the negative. If they do then the answer may be the opposite.

More to the point, it certainly demonstrates the hypocrisy of the left in decrying alleged executive branch influence. But I alsways forgot, your standards only apply to Republicans. And yes, I do subscribe ill intent on this President because his policies are going to ruin this country. Fortunately it appears that the American people (other than the 30% die hard liberals) are starting to wake up and see him for the socialist community agitator that he is.

Name:	JustAGuy -	Reply
Subject:	Messiah strongarm of CBO?
Date:	7/22/2009 8:25:20 PM

MM - "Apparently his highness summoned the head of CBO to the Oval Office to talk about the CBO conclusion that the health care will reduce health care quality and will cost trillions."

Dir. of CBO - "I was invited to the White House to meet with the President, his key budget and health advisers, and some outside experts. The President asked me and the outside experts for our views about achieving cost savings in health reform."

JustAGuy - he was "invited" not "summoned", and the purpose of the meeting was not as you described.

MM - "If you look at my post you will see that I reserved judgment if and when the CBO does a reversal of their indictment of the health care plan."

JustAGuy - "I do find it interesting that MM had to put the disclaimer at the beginning of the post....me thinks MM doth protest too much." (paraphrasing MM) :)

MM - "And yes, I do subscribe ill intent on this President ...."

JustAGuy - I think that is a very honest expression of your feelings, but what that means is that in every situation, you will always view what Obama is doing/not doing as a bad and harmful thing. You never give Obama anything resembling the benefit of the doubt, and instead you see ghosts and goblins lurking in the shadows (metaphorically speaking). And the worst part is that I'm afraid your blood pressure is going to go throught the roof and damage your health. :)

I think Obama is trying to do way too much, way too fast, and I think he is hurting the recovery of the economy. But I don't think he is inherently evil.

Name:	MartiniMan -	Reply
Subject:	Messiah strongarm of CBO?
Date:	7/22/2009 9:14:14 PM

Don't worry about my blood pressure as its just fine as is my health. You see, I and many others warned the middle of the road folks that taking a chance on hope and change was a dangerous gambit with Obama. What little we knew about him was not encouraging.

You say he is trying to do too much too fast as if he can't control himself. You are dead wrong about him. He knows exactly what he is doing and I am telling you if he succeeds he will do long-term harm to this country. For the life of me I can't understand how people like you, Archie and others were beside yourself about GW's $440B budget deficit but don't seem to care a whit about $23 trillion being foisted on us by Obama.

What magic powers this guy has over you. I am not fooled and I do not want my children and grandchildren to be saddled with trillions in debt unlike you are the others who appear to be satisfied to get yours and screw the next generation. Doing too much too fast........what an amazing way to characterize what is happening to this country.

Name:	JohnGalt -	Reply
Subject:	Messiah strongarm of CBO?
Date:	7/22/2009 9:31:03 PM

Gotta love that transparency.

URL: http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/washingtondc/la-na-healthcare-talks22-2009jul22,0,1752248.story

Name:	JustAGuy -	Reply
Subject:	Messiah strongarm of CBO?
Date:	7/22/2009 10:00:14 PM

MM, I'm glad to hear you are in good health. Please know that my comment about your blood pressure was with tongue firmly implanted in cheek.

As usual, I did not make myself completely clear. I do think Obama is trying to do too much too fast, but not because he can't control himself. I think he sees his popularity falling, and he knows that he will probably never be politically stronger in his administration than he is right now, and he is trying to "make hay while the sun is shining." Further, I disagree with many of the things he is doing. For instance, I think we need health care reform, but not the plan Obama is pushing. Obviously Republicans are against it, and now he is seeing moderate Dems push back too. I hope this results in a better plan.

I was never a GWB hater. I disagreed with a lot of his policies, but I never hated the man, or felt that he had inherently evil intent. I mainly wished that the Republican party had produced a better choice for us.

You have mentioned the $23 Trillion figure in a couple of posts. Isn't $23 Trillion the amount that the government will be on the hook for if every company that receives bailout money is unable to pay back the money? And if every loan, government backed program, etc. ALL go into the worst possible scenario? I don't think anybody believes that will happen. Having said that, obviously the government debt has grown astronomically in the last 9 months -- but I think to keep quoting the $23 Trillion figure diminishes your argument by seeming to be hyperbole.

I have forgotten recently to end my posts with my favorite phrase ....

My two cents :)

Name:	GoneFishin -	Reply
Subject:	John Galt
Date:	7/22/2009 11:19:37 PM

Thanks for post. I find the action by Obama as despicable as I assume you and
the Republicans did when Cheney had his similar secret meeting with the oil executives. The citizens deserve better from their elected leaders.

Name:	JustAGuy -	Reply
Subject:	John Galt
Date:	7/22/2009 11:59:27 PM

I agree ... I wanted to know which energy executives met with Cheney about Energy policy ... and I want to know which health care executives met with the Obama adminstration about Health Care policy.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Messiah strongarm of CBO?
Date:	7/23/2009 8:24:57 AM

Some of you guys crack me up. Do you honestly think that every meeting is sinister? Just a Guy got it right -- Obama is not inherently evil. More than likely, the CBO Director was asked to brief on their findings. I think it shows good judgement when an independent organization comes to a much different conclusion than you did, to find out how they arrived at their numbers.
And yes, I can understand why the Director of the CBO would be somewhat thrilled to be invited to meet with the President -- he is, afterall, the PRESIDENT.

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