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Name:	wix -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/23/2009 11:01:47 PM

From the thread below. OK, so the liberals have declared that I am mean spirited. I am mean spirited because I continue to call attention to some of the beliefs of the o-BAMA gang. These four posters all voted, I guess, for o-BAMA and by doing so they bought the whole program. When someone mentions something like taking God off coins, or abortion, or health care, etc., this crowd gets all indignant when we suggest they bought the whole program when they voted with the democrats. You can't pick and choose your poison, drink it all; you bought it.

Sorry guys, but someone needs to reinforce the fact that you made a terrible mistake for the future of this country, and I guess I'm just mean spirited enough to do it.

Name:	JustAGuy -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/23/2009 11:44:59 PM

First, I am not a liberal .. I have voted for both Dems and Repubs ..

Second, I challenge you to show that I ever posted that I voted for Obama ... I have posted that I voted against McCain, after he chose Sarah Palin as his running mate ... but I remind you that there were three other candidates on the ballot besides Obama and McCain ... my vote was a moot point ... all of Alabama's electoral votes were going to McCain, regardless of who I voted for.

"Taking God off coins" please post a source for this accusation

Contrary to what you say Wix ... I can in fact pick and choose ... I'm not a Kool-Aid drinker for either side ... I make my decisions based on my interpretation of the facts ... not because of dogma for either side of the argument.

You may think that you are some soldier for the conservatives by posting as you post ... but you are but one man ... just like me ... your opinion carries just as much weight as my opinion, and absolutely no more weight than my opinion.

One thing I am grateful for ... at least you admit that you are in fact mean spirited.

Name:	Yankee06 -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited ?????
Date:	8/24/2009 1:50:25 AM

-No, I don't think anyone here is mean spirited. Several highly opinionated perhaps. Some very party oriented.
-Based on teh last election, I believe a lot of us had/have to pick and choose on what we do or do not want to support.
-For Republicans, the really right wing and teh conservatives had nothing to support in McCain. Even teh liberal-conservatives didn't have much to support with teh tough economic situation Bush left them in.
-The dems were pretty much in teh same boat, with only the really liberal dems happy with Obama's record and policies. The rest of teh dems were happy about his race, hoping that electing a blackman would help with our longest-lasting problem of justice for all.
-SO how were all these people in the center (the independents, conservative dems, liberal repubs, etc) going to decide on whom to vote for. In my mind it was teh economy. If that's true, then there should be a lot of opportunity for everyone to be straying from party block votes, ...but for some reason yu just don't see that happening.
-Health Care: I find it hard to understand why every dem is for teh health care bill HR3200, and why every repub is against it....especially since practically no one's read it. However, I do think everyone is ready for health reform, so why can't a compromise be reached. For me, teh only answer is party politics.
-Abortion; I can't understand why this is supported down party lines. To me it would seem that this is a moral, ethical, or even bio-med issue that would have supporters in both parties and detractors in both parties. But it's usualaly cast as a dem-vs-repub issue. (The Catholics, who are mostly dems, are against it but subordinate it to the overall social justice program of teh dems)
-guns; what, there are no hunters in teh dem party? etc., etc,
-I just don't get it. In conversations, as soon as I support just one issue, I'm pegged with a certain party. If I then support a position affiliated with a different party, I'm called inconsistant and as one neighbor said, a "chaotic" thinker, I guess that's a nice way of saying he doesn't think I'm too bright.
-Mean spirited? I don't see mean spirited out there. but I do see some locked into party mind sets.
-Anyway, are there any of you out there that feel like I do? ...that Barny Franks is an idiot and liar, and so is Tom Delay. ...that niether Obama nor McCain could really have been the "best" this country had to offer, ...that just because the cente voted Obama in that they want his crazy left wing to run the coountry, that both parties and the maority of their platforms really stink....cuz, i'm not getting those vibes from our posts.
-See, when i'm looking for hope and change, I'm hoping for change from these two moribound parties and their myopic way of thinking.

Name:	architect -	Reply
Subject:	Well said
Date:	8/24/2009 6:22:25 AM

and I agree with 90+% of what you say and commend you to my post to Hound re: Joe Scarbourough and also suggest you google Micky Edwards (former OK house member).

Name:	water_watcher -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/24/2009 7:03:33 AM

You voted against McCain ... so you DID vote for Obama. Have some backbone and admit your error. The guy is a disaster. There is not a button to vote against someone ... you can ONLY vote FOR an individual. Now admit it.

As for God coming off coins ... are you asking for a source that this is true? If so, your source is to go to the bank and ask to see any of the new coins and you will see InGod we Trust is GONE. I believe the new currency that is being printed is also eliminating this.

You will come back and say well prove Obama ordered that ... all I can say is it was NEVER eliminated before and it is now under Obama. Context Clue. Even you can figure that one out.

Check your two cents and see if it contains God. That was my whole point (that you did not get) that pointed out it did not say what God ... but towel heads do think any reference to God in the US means a Christian God. I am one that believes, you don't come to our country and then ask everyone else to change so it does not offend you. You go to their homeland and they do not and they make you ware their clothes, especially women.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/24/2009 7:17:52 AM

Who in the Hell-o really cares if "in God we trust" is on our coins??? This is what I mean about cheap sentiment.
Have you considered that all of our currency was redesigned -- this didn't start under Obama -- it started under Bush. But, I doubt he looked at the design.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited ?????
Date:	8/24/2009 7:19:49 AM

I too agree with 99% with what you have so eloquently expressed.

Name:	green,ed -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/24/2009 9:14:32 AM

I think the majority of Americans care.

Name:	wix -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/24/2009 9:18:00 AM

Most of you have responded, and it appears that at least two admit voting against someone, one admits voting for o-BAMA, while the other may or may not have voted with the dems (I wouldn't admit it either). Yankee wants to pick and choose the liberal opinions he supports. Like, for example, maybe he is against the death penalty, but for abortion. Or, maybe he says he is against illegal immigration, but he wants to give them free health care. Folks, you can't have it both ways. I am a conservative, but I am about as apolitical as is humanly possible. Don't think I've ever met a politician that I liked very much or had a great deal of respect for. Don't really care for the power hungry, self-serving character makeup they all exhibit.

The most disturbing issue to me is that o-BAMA was elected because he attracted the guilt vote from people who didn't even bother to educate themselves about what the man stands for. Now that we all get a glimpse of his radical ideas maybe, just maybe, voters will acknowledge their mistake. I'm even seeing some denial amonst ya'll. Wake up, it's never too late.

There's a reason I'm mean spirited. If I can make you mad enough to re-evaluate your position then we both win.

Name:	MrHodja -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/24/2009 11:41:58 AM

I care.

Name:	wix -	Reply
Subject:	Is Hound Mean spirited?
Date:	8/24/2009 12:06:50 PM

I care if "In God We Trust" is on our money.

Name:	Lady -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/24/2009 1:21:06 PM

Sigh.........

http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/dollarcoin.asp

URL: http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/dollarcoin.asp

Name:	water_watcher -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/24/2009 1:25:25 PM

I do ... and I am proud to say that.

Name:	water_watcher -	Reply
Subject:	Snopes is wrong again
Date:	8/24/2009 1:36:26 PM

Further checking you will find that the "dollar coin" was printed with In God we Trust ...there was immediate backlash and they claimed that it was in error and it was suppose to be printed on the side. Now the ones without the In God We Trust is a collectors item.

But I am refering to the new quarters ... I am looking at one right now. If "In God we Trust" is on the coin I can not find it.

Maybe it is more of the "change" thing that Obama never let anyone in on during the election ... and people like you fell for it. But my guess is you vote for the democrat liberal no matter what.

Name:	Yankee06 -	Reply
Subject:	Cheap Sentiment, Coins, & God
Date:	8/24/2009 2:40:48 PM

-Cheap Sentiment, Coins, and God ---interesting huh??
-Cheap sentiment: I guess "sentiment," like beauty, depends on whose eyes are looking at it. Pesonally, I don't see flyovers, "in God We Trust", flags on porches, cars, etc., as cheap sentiment. These are symbols of what we believe in. (Sure, I know, Swastikas were symbols too). As we get older we sometimes get used to these things. But what about our young people. They no longer see these things intertwined into a living sense of what America is all about. Flyovers, flags, mottos, and other symbols are very important in making new citizens aware.
-God: I believe that even atheists should understand the importantance of the God concept in the birthing of America and in its continuance. AS important as teh God concept waas, Christianity was teh most important of teh God concepts (for Obama to stand up in Egypt and say that America is not a Christian nation was just stup[i ..errr, acted stupidly?. ..but that could be another discussion thread)
-But why is the concept of God important to Americans? because, as the Declaration states, our rights depend on our Creator. This is the most important concept in the Declaration and in the formation ofour independence. Because of this concept, our rights do not depend on any other man or group of men, or any other ideology. These rights are life, liberty, and teh pursuit of happiness; these are our rights as God's creatures. The Creator is ultimate authority as teh source of our freedoms, it is this upon which all our laws are based.
-Why is this important? Because if you take out God, and you are left with just a group of men saying these are our rights. Men are fallible. Another group of men could come along and say the first group of men were wrong, and we, the new group, are now correct, ...and here are your rights, --enter Marx and his communists/socialists; enter Hitler and his racists; enter...well, you know the rest.
-So if this is true, that our most basic rights are based on teh ultimate authority of God, a creator who gave us these rights as part of our human essence, ---then we must keep this concept at the core of our understanding of ourselves as free men and our country as the organization we ahve built to ensure these rights are protected and promoted. Not only must we keep this concept in front of ourselves, but especially in the forefront of teh next and future generations.
- We have to keep reminding ourselves of this, ...otherwise we risk losing the understanding of why we are the kind of people we are and why we are the kind of nation we are, --a nation of free men, not because some group of other men said that, but because the creator made us that way. Symbols, traditions, and education, as well as living examples, are the way we do that.

Name:	water_watcher -	Reply
Subject:	Well Said (nfm)
Date:	8/24/2009 3:00:21 PM

Name:	rude evin -	Reply
Subject:	Well Said (nfm)
Date:	8/24/2009 4:02:36 PM

Well said from me also........read it twice and still think it gives a good answer to the mushy minded......

Name:	JustAGuy -	Reply
Subject:	Another Source
Date:	8/24/2009 4:42:31 PM

WW: "Further checking you will find that the "dollar coin" was printed with (I think you meant without) In God we Trust ...there was immediate backlash and they claimed that it was in error and it was suppose to be printed on the side. Now the ones without the In God We Trust is a collectors item."
There is a very good source (link below) that explains what happened with the plain edge dollar coin printing error. Missing from the edges were "In God We Trust", "E Pluribus Unum", the printing month/day and location. You seem to think that "they" are trying to remove God from our coins ... the "they" would be the Bush Administration, since this event occurred in 2007. It was a minting error ... plain and simple.

WW:But I am refering to the new quarters ... I am looking at one right now. If "In God we Trust" is on the coin I can not find it."

I have 4 quarters in my pocket .. the first three I easily found "In God We Trust", on the fourth one these tired old eyes could not clearly make out any of the text, but with my trusty magnifier I was able to read all the text, including "In God We Trust". I can't speak for your quarter, but maybe try a magnifier.

URL: Plain Edge Dollars

Name:	wix -	Reply
Subject:	Excellent response, Yankee
Date:	8/24/2009 5:07:28 PM

Unfortunately, I get the feeling that some on this forum may feel that God is an "obsolete concept".

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/24/2009 5:31:04 PM

And I think you are wrong. The majority of Americans couldn't tell you what is on the coins to start with. If you are lamenting about that, you are probably still lamenting about the removal of "silver certificate" off the bills, and the fact that the coins are no longer silver.

But, the coins and the bills have been redesigned. This has been an on-going effort for a number of years now. So don't blame Obama for this one.

I think "concerned citizens" should write to the Secretary of the Treasury or your Congressional representative. They would kick it over to Treasury for a response. Staff would shake their heads and wonder why you didn't get a life.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/24/2009 5:33:16 PM

Guess you and the other "concerned citizen" can write your letters together. Or better yet, spend your nights and weekends raising a petition to get it back on there. Or stop by your elected officials local office and register your complaint. I'm sure they'd love to hear from you.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Yes, she is
Date:	8/24/2009 5:35:33 PM

And I know about 150 people that would probably agree that I am.

Now Wix, you get together with Hodja and Ed get your petitions going. Spend more of our taxpayer dollars getting the coins and bills redesigned again.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Why Do you care?
Date:	8/24/2009 5:39:24 PM

What possible difference does it make in your life if the coins say "in God we Trust" or not?
I think there are a number of people here who are spending their time caring about the wrong stuff. You don't want poor children to have a free hot meal -- can't work up any passion about that -- but words on a coin bring out your passion. GIVE ME A BREAK.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/24/2009 5:45:23 PM

You havent' made me mad or changed my views one iota. If the election was held tomorrow, I'd vote for Obama again. Never cared much for right wing extremists, but that's just me, and I make no apologies for it.

Name:	au67 -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/24/2009 6:05:17 PM

I thought you voted against McCain.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Snopes is wrong again
Date:	8/24/2009 6:28:12 PM

No they aren't. Where have you been getting your change? This coin program has been established well before Obama was even a candidate.
WW, I'm beginning to worry about you.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Yankee
Date:	8/24/2009 7:05:57 PM

Very nicely put. And I think agree with much of what you have said. Flyovers give me chill bumps. When I worked in the Pentagon and would go to the Hall of Heros and read the names, it would bring tears to my eyes. Remember during the first Gulf War, how there would be stories about individuals deploying and then coming home? Well, I spent that entire time in tears. And for about a week, they displayed the bronze statue comemorating the troops outside the cafeteria in the Pentagon, I cried again.

And I don't have any problem with displays of the flag on a porch or boat or any other place when it is done correctly. Where I start to have a problem is when people verbally wrap themselves in the flag as a means to justify their perspective. That to me is cheap sentiment. The "more patriotic than thou" routine.

And I agree that our nation is still primarily a Christian nation. But, our country has always been a melting pot, and you can't ignore the fact that Muslims, Buddists, Jews are all part of our culture. Even Wicca is now recognized as a legitimate religion. It may not be that way in this little corner of the South, but when you travel around the country, it's pretty clear that they are here to stay. And the beauty of it is that they are largely accepted into the community. And what makes our country great, is that we do this.

Most of the earliest settlers came to our country for religious freedom. So no doubt that influenced the Founding Father -- but I've also think that the wording was deliberate to show the King of England that they believed that there was a higher authority than just a King. You may recall from history this notion of the divine rigt of Kings -- that God spoke directly to Kings and the Kings authority came directly from God, so Kings could do whatever they wanted. I think the Founding Fathers challenged that notion by the wording of our Declaration of Independence. We don't know what was in their minds, other than what was written down at the time. I don't think there were a lot of Buddist and Muslims and such strutting the streets of Philadelphia and Boston at the time, so who knows what the wording might had been if there were.

But, again, it is "cheap sentiment" to me, when someone tries to wrap themselves in "God" and Christianity as a means of making some political point about money and currency. For me, God is in my heart, so I don't care if our currency reads in God we trust, or in Dog we trust. It's much too important to derive it's significance from that.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/24/2009 7:07:56 PM

Yup, I did. And if an election was held tomorrow with McCain and Obama, I'd vote for Obama again.

Name:	MrHodja -	Reply
Subject:	Why Do you care?
Date:	8/24/2009 9:58:55 PM

What exactly do you stand for? All I seem to hear is what you are against.

Name:	MrHodja -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/25/2009 8:46:28 AM

I care because of what it stands for, and am sorry you can't seem to see and/or appreciate and/or accept that. I am not an activist and don't go around drumming up partitions - nor do I thump my chest and scream "I am a Christian look at me".

That does not mean that I don't care that our nation is getting away from its trust in God - and yes, I care that we overtly demonstrate that trust by putting "In God We Trust" on our coins.

Did you have some boss in the past to try to force religion in you? You surely seem anti-organized religion. I am not going to try to tell you organized religion doesn't have its shortcomings, but it does give like-minded people an opportunity to worship together, and it bothers me that you paint all with the same brush.

Finally, when you ascribe untoward intentions to those who wear their Christianity openly, please do not forget that Christians believe in the Bible, and Matthew 28:18-20 (NIV) says:

"Then Jesus came to them and said, "18All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in[a] the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age."

The big difference between Christians and the Muslims who would destroy us is that modern Christians don't fulfill the Great Commission by force.

I am done with this thread.

Nasreddin Hodja

Name:	lamont -	Reply
Subject:	Wow, Struck a Nerve with Hound
Date:	8/25/2009 9:49:11 AM

I also have a problem with taking "In God We Trust" off the coin. There again, I am a Bible-Thumping Right Wing Extremist and freely admit it. And yes, I voted for McCain not against Obama. Why can't Libs just admit they are Libs and voted for Obama. Why do they have to call themselves Moderates or Progressives and continue to say " I voted against McCain" not for Obama. I get so tired of their diversionary tactics. If this board is any indication, one would assume nobody actually voted for Obama and his poliicies. They all just voted against McCain. How convenient.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Mean spirited
Date:	8/25/2009 12:54:10 PM

You are right, I'm not a believer in organized religion. But, I have no quarrel with anyone that feels comfortable with reguarly ( or even irregularly) attending the place of worship of their choice when they do it because of a sincere belief, not a desire to tell someone else how to live. I admire people of true faith but please don't construe this as that I'm for terrorists or anyone else who takes their beliefs and hurts others. I'm talking about the kind of people who live their beliefs and don't leave them at the door on Sunday. And I'm not going into a discussion of my spiritual beliefs on this or any other forum. I don't hide my beliefs, but I don't discuss it with people I don't know well.

But, in my view, this discussion has nothing to do with religion per se, and whether you believe or go to church. My only point is this -- our country will be judged by it's actions and the way we conduct ourselves and not because we put "in God we trust" on our currency. If we are people of God who put our trust in God, then others will know it by our leadership and our actions.

Name:	wix -	Reply
Subject:	That explains a lot
Date:	8/25/2009 6:00:56 PM

Name:	architect -	Reply
Subject:	Don't worry about WW
Date:	8/25/2009 6:15:56 PM

He's just one more Christian that think its more important to express your religion in grafitti than in your life and actions. By the way did you know that only two nations on the planet make reference to God on their flag?...Iraq and Iran.

Name:	Talullahhound -	Reply
Subject:	Don't worry about WW
Date:	8/25/2009 9:08:59 PM

I have to say that I'm just astounded by this thread. I guess I should have known that people would put such an emphasis on symbolism. Makes no sense to me, but to each his own.

I already knew that for some people here, the only source for "truth" is the one that agrees with how they think things are.

Name:	architect -	Reply
Subject:	Preach it Hound!
Date:	8/25/2009 9:35:43 PM

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