| Name: |
rainbow slough
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| Subject: |
I/O vs outboard
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Date:
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5/8/2007 1:52:04 PM
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Posting here and in boat maintainence. I'm looking at a couple of used boats. All pontoons 2 I/O and one Outboard (150 Yamaha). I've had an outboard 115 evinrude on a 24' that we have loved and done little to, save routine maintainance. My question is, I've always had in my mind that and I/O on a pontoon is a bad thing. Don't know if I heard that from someone and really don't have any reason to back it up. The thing is, the boat that has my juices flowing is an I/O! I really like the way I look in it! Someone tell me it's ok to buy, or if there is a reason not to...tell me that too.
As they say on the radio...first time poster, long time reader, so be kind.
Thanks!
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I have a 4 cyl mercruiser I/O in my pontoon and it works great; those motors will run for a long time if properly serviced but some I/O's are hard to work on because of how the engine compartment is designed.
I prefer the I/O over a 2 stroke outboard, but I would also highly consider a 4 stroke outboard because they are so quiet.
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| Name: |
Maverick
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| Subject: |
I/O vs outboard
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Date:
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5/8/2007 2:30:38 PM
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My opinion and I own an I/O pontoon is; go for the outboard
4 Stroke Outboard
- Should have better fuel economy
- Definitely Quitter
- Do not have to winterize, can leave in water year-round
- Maint cost may be a little more but should not be much more, as the I/O is very easy to work on.
- Probably easier to source parts locally on an outboard as more dealers
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
I/O vs outboard
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Date:
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5/8/2007 2:31:47 PM
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I agree with jlazc. I've always liked I/Os because I can work on them. Outboards can cost you a fortune in repair parts. Only buy I/O if is Mercury or Volvo. Like jlazc said, check out the access to the motor on the I/O--some of them are terrible. Also, I prefer the Bravo Mercury outdrive to the Alpha I, but the Bravo only comes in the larger V-8s so you may not have that option. New pontoon purchase; go 4 cycle outboard--whole new world.
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| Name: |
rainbow slough
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| Subject: |
I/O vs outboard
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Date:
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5/8/2007 3:03:41 PM
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MAN, Just checked back a got all this! I've always enjoyed reading the forums, but really didn't think I would get a response so quickly.
The thing that stands out in the advise you folks offered is something I didn't think about. I would want to leave it in the water as we have year-round water in Rainbow Slough. I've only dry stored my boat once and it was too much of a hassle to get back in ect... when winterizing is so easy.
Can I not do that with an I/O???...That may make my decision.
Thanks again for the help!
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| Name: |
Maverick
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| Subject: |
I/O Has to Be Winterized
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Date:
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5/8/2007 3:48:10 PM
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Block has water inside. If it freezes the block can crack.
Guess at the least you could just pull the freeze plugs after each use and drain the block.
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| Name: |
AnchorbayDon
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| Subject: |
I/O vs outboard
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Date:
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5/8/2007 9:17:09 PM
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The newer Mercruisers have a 'pull to drain' block draining feature so that you can easily drain the block. If its a new one, see that it has a little blue lever on the top of the block.
Your choice is easy - You can't go wrong either way! The I/O will give you a little more power out of the hole and the 4 stroke will give you quieter performance and a little stronger top end. At this stage, I would not consider a 2 stroke or an Evinrude E-Tech which is a 2 stroke oil injection which has not been proven enough for me!
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| Name: |
PillPipe
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| Subject: |
I/O vs outboard
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Date:
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5/9/2007 11:02:15 AM
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not sure I'd want a motor that's a quitter.
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| Name: |
MotorMan
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| Subject: |
I/O vs outboard
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Date:
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5/9/2007 8:09:25 PM
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Common in salt water, you can get an i/o with a heat exchanger. The anti-freeze stays in the block and the water drains out when it is raised out of the water.
A Volvo i/o can be had in dou-prop. I have a Hurricane (for sale $21,900) and it tracks like it had a keel. It can do the ONE thing than no pontoon can that can save your life. You can run it at 12 to 16 mph and the bow stays up to ride over waves up to five feet. hign. It has a flat deck like a pontoon boat but a hulled bottom. Its at Harbor Pointe Marina. 825-0600
I got cought in a small craft blow on Sarasota Bay in an Apache Seamaster pontoon like deck boat and the thing almost drowned us. Avoid these like the plague. I threw it into a house sale deal for one dollar. I did not want to sell it to someone. Its something to see a foot of sea water on the deck with five foot seas..
The 225 hp Yamaha 2.7 Liter 2 stroke outboards are picky about their 12 gold spark plugs. If you get an outboard, get a 4 stroke and stay one step below the max for the displacement as they all are picky at max hp per cu inch. Meaning if the v-6s come 150, 175, 200, and 225, get the 200 hp. Same if v-4 at 85, 115, 140, get the 115.
Year round water means year round growth on bottom. Expect to give it a good bottom cleaning in spring.
OB is cheapest. i/o is quietest. i/o is heavy to give a more solid ride.
write steve@artworkbyandy.com for more info or ask more questions.
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a 4 stroke outboard is quieter than any I/O I have ever had (which is several) or seen. I like my current I/O, but would trade it in a minute for a 4 stroke outboard in an even up deal. Quite is key (for me) on a pontoon, as we are usually cruising slow with friends and talking. I will not have another 2 stroke pontoon though; been there, done that, too noisy.
As for safety and smoothness, a quality pontoon boat with properly sized pontoons and an appropriate load will ride better and smoother than a hurricane (pure physics). I have been out on the roughest water LM has to offer in my Harris with no problems. I have also been on a hurricane (more than once) and about bit my tongue off in choppy water because of the large, relatively flat bottom. The newer models are better than the original design, but still have a lot of displacement to make things rough.
If you want a smooth riding boat that will handle the waves of LM, get a tritoon or a large pontoon, and don't overload the boat. Even in the unlikely event that the water comes over the deck, the pontoons are sealed and you are not going to sink.
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
I don't know...
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Date:
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5/9/2007 10:40:34 PM
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'bout someone in a five foot chop in a pontoon boat--anywhere, anytime, on purpose or not!!!
While you're talking about fresh water cooling systems (heat exchangers) you'll need to mention that some systems still use raw to cool the manifolds and will not gravity drain when you haul the boat--also, the engine mounted raw water pump (Volvo & Merc Bravo) may not gravity drain completely.
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| Name: |
8hcap
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| Subject: |
I don't know...
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Date:
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5/10/2007 9:48:59 AM
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Back when I had a condo at the beach and fished some, there was a guy that went out trolling the blue water in his pontoon (25-30 miles offshore). He had twin engines but everyone thought he was totally insane.
8
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
HE WAS!!...
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Date:
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5/10/2007 10:19:47 AM
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| Name: |
Tallyman
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| Subject: |
I/O vs outboard
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Date:
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5/10/2007 10:21:22 AM
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It seems to me that everyone has to get married once and to own an I/O once. My advice is to avoid both.
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| Name: |
MotorMan
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| Subject: |
Dear Osms and others
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Date:
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5/10/2007 11:39:56 AM
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Osms said:
" I don't know... 'bout someone in a five foot chop in a pontoon boat--anywhere, anytime, on purpose or not!!! "
Dear Osms:
It has been said that a boat that stays in harbor is safe, but that is not what boats are built for.
I do not blame the dead in Kansas for not sleeping in their shelters. They lived their lives as they best they saw fit. Sudden weather happens.
I left on that boat trip a clear sunny morning. This small craft warning formed in the Gulf of Mexico, blew into the Bay unseen by RADAR and by the time I saw the first clouds, it was too late.
While its impossible to sink a pontoon swim raft, it is possible to depress a pontoon boat with sides long enough to get water into the engine and then have no power to steer. A boat without power can capsize and be deadly. It may float for years as said above. It will not sink.
Six inches of water on a 8x20 foot deck weighs about 5000 pounds. 80 cu feet at 64.2 pounds/ cu ft. 62.4 for fresh water but its little difference. I only saved my engine by opening all the doors and letting the water run out faster.
Lake Martin is very very safe compared even to little Sarasota Bay. The big saving grace is all the islands. A boat with power can always get to the lee side of an island and the crew can sleep overnight if needed. Lightning is more of a danger. Tampa is the lightning killer capital of the Country. I read of beach goers killed from clouds 5 miles away. One teacher got fried walking home from school. We all take our chances. If you ever cast a fly line out and it floats in the air or your hair stands on end, you know what I mean. The man who went 30 miles out in a pontoon boat is no more insane than mountain climbers.
I should have said a 2 stroke ob is cheapest dollar per hp. The supercharged 4 stroke Mercurys in the 250 - 300 hp range do everything good. They are the quietest. They get good gas mileage. They cost $25,000. My whole boat with 270 hp Volvo, duo-prop was $29,990
The old 1990's Hurricanes were real kidney busters, I'll admit. Rode like my 1971 tri-hull. Mine is much better than the old ones. There are times in higher chop I do slow down to 20 mph for comfort. You can't go 40+ mph in every sea.
In 1981 I bought a i/o merc. that was only 18 months old. When I parked it in the yard and pulled the plug it killed the grass. I found out Mercury had secured the aluminum gas line to the iron block with a brass nut. With salt water, this is a natural battery and the least noble metal is eaten away. I swore off i/o for 25 years. I'm on fresh water now and they got better.
Besh wishes on your quest of a boat. We all "pays our money and take our chances", in all aspects of life. Good Luck.
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| Name: |
MotorMan
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| Subject: |
price update
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Date:
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5/10/2007 12:20:53 PM
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The 275 Verado has a MSRP of $20,855.00
The aluminum block 300 that is higher priced is coming out this Fall.
URL: various Mercury engine prices
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| Name: |
rainbow slough
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| Subject: |
I/O vs outboard
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Date:
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5/10/2007 1:48:41 PM
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Thanks to all on the advise! The marriage has worked out great for me so I think I'm going to go against Tallyman and take my turn on the I/O. The dollar per power value has me hooked, I can't afford as late a model 4 stroke outboard as I can get with the I/O. Wish me luck!
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
Motorman
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Date:
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5/10/2007 1:59:47 PM
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Many of us have spent some time off shore. The more time you spend in open water the more respect you gain for the power of the unforgiving waves and water. Over the many years I spent of the coast and the many deaths I know occurred, practically all were families that ventured off shore in a boat too small, w/o life vests, etc. They didn't intend to die, but because they were under prepared, in the wrong type boat, etc., they died. These things CAN be prevented by the use of common sense.
I've spent more money on one outboard motor (Mercury oil pump gear went out--cooked the engine), than on all the I/Os I've owned put together.
No scheduled maintenance would have prevented the oil pump failure--if I had been smart I would have pre-mixed oil and gas after the warranty expired. I don't recommend I/Os for leaving in salt water--common sense. Always had inboards--no problems.
Agree with all that new 4-cycle outboards are the future of small boating.
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
Good Luck...
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Date:
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5/10/2007 2:02:05 PM
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what brand and size engine I/O do you intend to get?
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| Name: |
rainbow slough
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| Subject: |
Good Luck...
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Date:
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5/10/2007 2:08:59 PM
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Looking now at 3.
1, the Fisher that is in the classifieds here...havn't seen yet.
2. a Harris that a friend has 2000 model w/ 240
3. a riviera that an aquaniatence has that is a 1999
the last 2 are in the $ 10 - 12,000 range.
Also have a friend who is selling his Harris w/ 150 4 stroke, 2005. He just needs to get more than I can write a good check for.!
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| Name: |
AnchorbayDon
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| Subject: |
Good Luck...
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Date:
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5/10/2007 2:38:28 PM
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Just FYI, Riviera Cruiser is long since out of business and if you would ever need a part for the boat, you would be stuck. The Harris is a very well built boat.
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It's hard to help sight unseen, but I think the Harris is a no brainer with those choices..... A 2000 in good shape for under 12K is a good price.
How much does your friend want for the 4 stroke?
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| Name: |
rainbow slough
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| Subject: |
I agree with Don
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Date:
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5/10/2007 5:02:11 PM
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He gave me a price of 25K, don't know if that was the buddy's discount or the screw the bud who you know wants a new boat price!
It's a very nice boat and at 25, I think a good price. I just don't want to finance anything.
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| Name: |
Maverick
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| Subject: |
Rainbow Slough
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Date:
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5/10/2007 7:10:24 PM
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I ahve a 2000 Harris with 130 I/O Vovlo with 125 hours I was thinking about selling, but changed my mine, and I was not going to take less the $14,500 for it at a minimum i this helps any.
Actually had it sold at $14,500, but told the guy it was not for sale.
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
2005 Harris...
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Date:
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5/10/2007 7:20:43 PM
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FYI, I called on an ad in the B'ham News last Sunday on a 2005 Harris 24' Classic (Blue) with 150 4cycle Yamaha that the guy wanted $25K. Boat had 295 hours on it--that's a lot of hours for a 2005. I was quoted $28K last fall by Blue Creek for a 24' Classic w/150 Merc Verado 4 cycle.
That may give you a reference point.
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| Name: |
Maverick
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| Subject: |
Rainbow Slough
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Date:
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5/10/2007 7:37:13 PM
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Sorry forgot to state it is a 2000 Harris Euro Classic, diff models diff prices.
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| Name: |
fountain
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| Subject: |
2005 Harris...
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Date:
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5/11/2007 1:05:52 PM
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Been shopping for about a month $25,000.00 seems like a fair price if the boat was nice. What paper ?
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
2005 Harris...
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Date:
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5/11/2007 1:52:29 PM
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Last Sunday's edition of The Birmingham News.
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
fountain...
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Date:
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5/11/2007 2:17:38 PM
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that $28K price I got was for a NEW 2006 Harris Classic.
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| Name: |
fountain
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| Subject: |
fountain...
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Date:
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5/11/2007 3:24:21 PM
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Been pricing 2007 Harris Classic with Mercury outboard--35,000.00--38,500.00 ????
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| Name: |
fountain
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| Subject: |
2005 Harris...
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Date:
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5/11/2007 3:25:03 PM
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THANK YOU
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| Name: |
Osms
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| Subject: |
fountain...
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Date:
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5/11/2007 3:48:11 PM
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I got the price last October. They quoted me the same as you last week--it's spring time! New boat sales are in the toilet--wait a month or so.
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| Name: |
MotorMan
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| Subject: |
Prices...prices..prices
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Date:
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5/11/2007 5:45:00 PM
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Nothing is cheap anymore. Copper hit $4/pound a while ago. Aluminum hit $1.50 an is now about $1.30/pound. Crude oil is draging up the cost of moving everything. Many of the resins in a boat is really made of natural gas or oil.
I paid very little for gas to run my boat last year as I only put 17 hours on it. I have a solar powered little boat I use more often.
Good luck on your quest. I would NEVER think of paying $48,000 for a Bennington pontoon boat. I don't care how smug the salesmen are. It is too much for a piece of aluminum.
URL: aluminum price chart
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| Name: |
woodman60
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| Subject: |
I/O vs outboard
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Date:
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5/15/2007 11:08:27 PM
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I think the OB gets better fuel ecomomy numbers. My bennington 2575 I/O loves the fuel (Merc V-8) but does performs well. Cost 150$ to fill up but I only fill up 3 times a year(big tank). I have a wife and I/O but would not trade either one..... well ..... the wife sometimes comes close.
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